Considerations on Sexual Immorality, Gender Identity, and my friends Non-Denominational Church.
A good friend of mine from a fairly conservative evangelical background is considering becoming a pastor at his non-denominational church. As part of the evaluation process, they asked him to write a paper on these topics that he is not an expert on.
He asked for my opinion and I offered to share it online to solicit constructive criticism, notes of encouragement, and or reading recommendations on these topics.
I believe his goal is to be faithful to the scriptures, loving to those outside the church, and challenging to those inside the church, as most of us could do better.
What he wrote is in the quotation marks below.
“1: Scope of the Issue
Sexual immorality has become a besetting and ubiquitous issue in our culture and in our churches. While many aspects of it are not novel or unique to this time and have clear scriptural input, there are others that bring challenges to our church for which we don’t have obvious precedent. The main point of these comments is to try and answer three questions with some degree of specificity: (1) how do we make ourselves a place where people who do not know Christ will feel welcome to come and learn of Him regardless of where they come from, (2) how do we pastorally care for people who have come in to the church with pre-existing circumstances related to sexual immorality, and (3) how do we equip our members to represent Christ to those in their lives that are dealing with these issues. We want to do this in a way that does not “walk a tight rope” or compromise to appease, but honors Scripture in its commands to both show compassion and exhort and correct. We must recognize that every individual circumstance is unique, and many will require careful and prayerful consideration, but this is meant to give a framework for that consideration.
2: Scriptural Basis for Corporate Response
There are many references we can point to that discuss and define sexual immorality throughout Scripture and many of these will be used below as we consider specific examples and situations. Let us start, however, by looking at passages that deal with corporate response rather than individual sin. It is clear that the Corinthian church had significant issues in this area, and much of Paul’s first letter was devoted to it. In chapter 5, Paul states that when sexual immorality is discovered in the church we should “mourn” over it and “not to associate with immoral people.” Importantly, he also makes clear in vv. 9-13 that these comments only apply to those “who bears the name of brother.” He explicitly writes, “not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world…for what have I to do with judging outsiders?” This is key in informing our response to those who are not members of the church. If it is our desire to see sinners come through our doors and come to know our Savior through our ministry, then we must be welcoming, accepting them where they are. This is not to say we hide or compromise the biblical position, but it is not an issue on which we want to filter people at the door. There are three categories of people in sexual sin that we need to form a response for. First, those just coming to the church who have not committed to it – these should be treated the same as any we are reaching out to with Christ’s love. They need Jesus, not behavioral change. Next, those who have recently joined the church but have pre-existing sexual sin patterns. This can and should be addressed with patience, dignity, and love. There are often many sin areas in the life of a new believer, and it is prudent to discern how and when to address each of them. Lastly, those who have been members in the church for some amount of time and fall into sexual sin. This is the group that Paul is primarily addressing in 1 Corinthians. While sex within marriage is a private issue, sexual sin cannot be a taboo topic. It needs to be addressed regularly and clearly. We need close enough relationships within the church that such problems do not fester in the dark. We must avoid the typical church pattern to vilify the first group, never see the second group, and pretend the third group doesn’t exist until it all blows up in scandal. May it never be.
3: Consistency Issue
There is a tendency in our Christian culture to treat some sexual sins as worse than others. Like the Corinthians, some things we seem to have accepted as just ubiquitous parts of our culture. Knowing the prevalence of promiscuity and fornication among teens and single adults and usage of pornography even within the church, we tend to address these as issues of indwelling sin, similar to anger or fear of man, with offers of accountability and understanding when someone falls. By contrast, when it comes to homosexuality or adultery, it is often a church discipline issue. We view homosexual marriage as a major problem, but remarriage after a non-biblical divorce is rarely addressed. These inconsistencies lead to stigmatization and polarization and should have no place in the church. The criterion for escalation should be unrepentance, not the nature of the sexual sin. It is clear from 1 Corinthians that all should be taken seriously, but none should be vilified above others.
4: Culture and Identity
The major underlying problem with many of the sexual sin and gender issues is that they have come to be culturally bound up with people’s identities. This is not a new phenomenon and is not unique to this issue. As far back as Acts 19, you see people becoming “enraged” because Paul had threatened the Ephesians’ cultural identity as worshipers of Artemis. People continue to find their primary identities in their employment, hobbies, sports teams, or families rather than Christ. None of these should be accepted, but none should be reviled either. If a person does not know Jesus, they are dead. How they identify themselves is of no concern. Once they have been made alive, they can be taught that “whose” they are is more important than “who” they are. All identity outside of Christ is not sinful, but if it takes paramount importance, it may become so. A person who recognizes a tendency toward same sex attraction may label themselves as gay or lesbian. This should not be considered a sin issue unless it becomes, for them, their defining characteristic or leads to sinful actions. We should recognize the difficulty of this struggle and support such a person rather than get hung up on labels. There must be clear distinction between identifying same sex attraction and engaging in homosexual behavior. These should be the guiding principles underlying everything that follows are regards individual cases.
5: Public Facing Information, Guests, and New Attendees
Considering what we have discussed, and Paul’s assertion in 1 Corinthians 5 that we ought to reserve judgment on sexual immorality to those we call brother, I would submit that public facing information regarding the church (i.e. website, app, etc) should not publish a position on sexual immorality, marriage, and gender identity. Doing so effectively places the filter at the door so that people who do not know Christ may be turned away from it. This is not tantamount to tacit approval. In appropriate contexts within the church, these topics should still be discussed and addressed, but I do not believe it is consistent with a biblical treatment of unbelievers to place it in a public facing forum. If we have guests or new regular attendees who appear to be engaged in a cohabitating or fornicating relationship, a homosexual relationship, or other sexual sin, this should not be a priority to address unless we have discerned that they are believers and join the church. Even then, it is important to draw a distinction between someone who deals with same-sex attraction and someone who engages in homosexual behavior. The next seven points are meant to discuss, in broad terms, how we should address those who join the church with pre-existing relationships or identity issues:
6: Promiscuity, Cohabitation – Hebrews 13:4, 1 Cor 7:1-2, Ex 22:16
Much of the biblical discussion on promiscuity is by inference. Clearly, sex was meant to be inseparably linked to marriage and outside of that context should be considered immoral. For those who join the church already in a sexual relationship who are unmarried we should apply Exodus 22:16 and encourage them to marry as soon as possible. If they do not wish to marry, they should be encouraged to separate. Paul acknowledges in 1 Cor 7:2 that marriage is the best remedy for “temptation to sexual immorality.”
7: Adultery, Divorce and Remarriage – Matt 5:32, Matt 19:9, 1 Cor 7:10-11
This issue is given much more explicit biblical instruction but is often glossed over in our Christian culture due to the messy landscape of divorces and remarriages. In cases where non-biblical divorce has occurred, if reconciliation is possible, this should be pursued. If reconciliation is impossible because one or more parties have remarried, it would not be sensible to divorce again in order to achieve reconciliation. The principle to apply here, I believe, is from 1 Cor 7:17-24 summarized in verse 20: “Each one should remain in the condition in which he was called.” This is not an ideal circumstance, but it is the best way forward in an imperfect world. Of note, polygamy was common in the culture of the early church, and while not ideal, was accepted by the church, as evidenced by the qualifications for elder to be “a husband of but one wife.” We have polygamous cultures even within our local community and if they came to Christ, we should not counsel them to divorce all but one wife and thus disrupt their social structure. It is not ideal and would disqualify them from eldership, but they should remain as they are. Whether marriage after unbiblical divorce in the past disqualifies a man from eldership is a case-by case question for the eldership.
8: Pornography, Sensuality, and Lust – Lev 18:6-18, Matt 5:28
As mentioned above, use of pornography has reached a high saturation point within our culture and within our church. While once thought of as simply a male issue, there is a growing trend toward gender parity in pornography usage. It is an issue that should be discussed with some frequency within our church. For those that join the church and view pornography regularly, it needs to be made clear that while the world has largely destigmatized it, it is still sexual immorality. Furthermore, this isn’t just limited to nudity and pornography, but any sensuality that leads to looking at someone “with lustful intent” is the heart equivalent of adultery according to Matt 5:28. In our culture, it is not possible to avoid such things by just turning away. We need to address the heart issues of idolatry, selfishness, and satisfaction in Christ. Practically, how should we deal with those who have on-going struggles with pornography, sensuality and lust? Should this preclude them from eldership? From deaconship? Taken strictly, this would preclude nearly all men from eldership. These require individual evaluation from the elders, but a guiding principle should be, if the person is repentant and there is evidence of growth in their life, we should consider more responsibility and continued discipleship.
9: Homosexuality – Lev 18:22, Lev 20:13, 1 Cor 6:9, 1 Tim 1:8-11
From the above references and others, it is evident that homosexual behavior is sexual sin. We cannot equivocate on that point. As we have discussed above, if a person who is already a believer and in the church and struggles with same sex attraction, we should approach them as we would handle anyone who is sexually attracted to someone to whom they are not married. If such a person decides that homosexuality is not sinful and begins sexually immoral activity, we should deal with them in the same way as any member who falls into unrepentant sin and go through the processes of correction and, if necessary, of church discipline. It is important that we draw a distinction between same sex attraction and homosexual behavior. We can do tremendous harm by demonizing same sex attraction and creating a taboo around it. A person who is struggling to abstain from homosexual behavior should be supported and encouraged. I believe Paul’s strong statements about not associating with sexually immoral people applies to those who remain unrepentant. Much more nuanced is the issue of how we address those that join the church already in a homosexual relationship. What about the married homosexual couple who join the church with their adopted child? Should we break up their family? I believe, in this case, the same principle should apply as to those who have gone through an unbiblical divorce in the past. We should apply 1 Cor 7:20: “Each one should remain in the condition in which he was called.” We can recognize that this is not ideal, but it is the best we can do in a fallen world just as we do with someone who is married after unbiblical divorce. Whether should apply to a homosexual couple in a long term committed relationship who are not legally married would be an individual discussion with the elders. Again, these are nuanced cases that will need individual prayer, discussion, and discernment. I believe a great deal more patience is called for when a new believer joins the church that has a history or present reality of homosexuality, even if they are unrepentant at first, believing that homosexuality is not sinful, than we would demonstrate to a person who has been in the church for a period of time and then decides to pursue a homosexual relationship.
10: Bisexuality – Heb 13:4
Bisexual attraction is no more or less of an issue than anyone who finds that they are sexually attracted to someone other than their spouse. This is not a rare or unique circumstance, even within the church. Someone who is practicing bisexuality is, by definition, not confining sex to the marriage bed, and this, therefore, qualifies as sexual immorality. The issue, here again, is one of identity and cultural acceptance. If a person “identifies as bisexual,” the real issue is not the bisexuality, but the fact that they identify themselves primarily by their sexual desires, and not by Christ. It would be equally a problem if they “identified as heterosexual” and that was seen as their defining characteristic. If such a person were to join the church, our priority should be in helping them see their identity in Christ rather than focusing on renouncing their sexual preference.
11: Transgenderism/Non-binarism – Psalm 139: 13-15
It should be noted that the next two points should not be considered in the category of sexual immorality, but as they are connected to the same cultural moment will be discussed here. It should further be remarked that transgenderism is a modern issue with no direct reference in Scripture. It is a challenging issue that often falls prey to oversimplification and scapegoating. It is not sufficient to simply state that a person should identify with their born gender. There are those born with ambiguous genitalia and those born with sex chromosome abnormalities such that “born gender” is not necessarily accurate. These occur with a frequency of 1 in 448 births on average which is not particularly rare. The majority of people who consider themselves to be transgender do not fall into these categories, but the fact remains that these categories exist. Unless we plan to embark on genetic testing, we must be careful how we assert someone’s gender assignment. Furthermore, we must acknowledge that much of the gender confusion in our culture is due to a distortion of biblically accurate masculinity and femininity in our culture of which the church has been widely supportive for generations. Many transgender and non-binary individuals consider themselves so because they do not fit into the traditional boxes our culture has created for the genders. The church can start by recognizing that these boxes are incorrect. We can also acknowledge that gender differences and roles are far less important than most human cultures perceive. Christ himself challenged many gender norms in his ministry and Paul maintains “…there is no male or female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.” (Gal 3:28b) It is much more difficult to recognize this issue as a sin issue than many of the above concerns. If someone wishes to be addressed by different pronouns than they once did or dress differently than they once did, this does not amount to immorality. Once again, this can be an idolatrous identity issue if the person sees it as the central characteristic of their lives. There is often an inherent pride in asserting that such a person does not feel they fit in the body created for them, but if they come to love Jesus and understand and believe that they are “fearfully and wonderfully made” then this issue may become moot. Whether or not they revert to dressing differently or using pronouns they did when they were younger is largely immaterial. This also addresses the issue of people who may have undergone permanent physical changes. While we should not endorse such modification if it is being considered, there is no reason to reverse such a thing in order to return to a base state. We must recognize that this is a group that has a high propensity toward mental health concerns, instability, and suicidality. They need love, support and prayer, not scapegoating and extra-biblical expectations of conforming to a cultural norm. We must further note that this group as well as the homosexual group have often experienced psychological and even physical harm from others in our culture, sometimes in the name of Christ. We must foster an environment of champions physical and psychological safety for these people.
12: Asexuality – 1 Cor 7:25-38
Asexuality also should not be considered sexual immorality. There is, in fact, wide support in Paul’s letters such as in 1 Cor 7 for people, if they are able, to remain unmarried and be “anxious about the things of the Lord, how to please the Lord.” We tend to champion the model of the nuclear family in our Christian culture, but Paul sees chaste singleness as a better way. There should be no pressure from the church to make sure that single people pair off and get married because it is expected of them. As this state has been culturally identified with the LGBTQIA movement, it is seen on the same spectrum as the sexual immorality and gender issues discussed above, but it is not. It can still fall prey to the same issue of an idolatrous identity as some of the above issues, but it need not be so.
13: Glass Ceiling
In the event that God sees fit to bring people from these subgroups into our church, there would inevitably be a glass ceiling. The question is at what point. The four logical points are: regular attender, member, deacon, and elder. Regardless of their background or position, all should be welcome to be a regular attender. It is also clear, from the biblical requirements for eldership, that on-going problems or engagement in any of the sexual sins would disqualify them from that post. The middle two are less clear. I would submit that the bar for membership should be very low. This step, in my opinion, is when they would “bear the name of brother” and not before. Even if they disagree about the sinful nature of homosexuality, this should not disallow them from becoming members as long as they agree to submit to the churches position and not cause division. Allowing them to become members gives us the pastoral authority to speak into their lives, and we would hope that over time the Spirit would work in their hearts to convince them of the truth. Putting such a person in a deacon role would probably not be wise but would need to be evaluated prayerfully on a case-by-case basis. The difficulty here is that, while a position on homosexuality is not a salvific issue and should not be considered a core doctrine in the same way as the deity of Christ, for example, it is a sin issue. There is a limit to how far we can “agree to disagree” and still uphold our duty to root out sin in our midst. Once again, we should also distinguish between a struggle with same sex attraction and engagement in homosexual behavior when we consider our response. There is also a glass ceiling when it comes to marriage. While I believe we should not break up existing homosexual marriages, we should not participate in creating them. The marriage covenant between a man and woman was created, in part, to reflect the relationship between Christ and the church (Eph 5). This should not be co-opted to excuse or normalize immorality.
14: Nuance and Edge Cases
The above outline is by no means meant to be exhaustive or definitive. It is meant to provide a lens, supported by scripture, through which we can view these issues and consider corporate and pastoral responses. It should inform how we view the people that walk through the door from a wide range of backgrounds and how we equip those in our church to be Christ’s ambassadors to those in our community. Every person and circumstance, history and baggage will be different, and any non-nuanced position would be inherently evil. I pray we have many opportunities to talk, think and pray through specific situations that God would bless us with the chance to be a part of. What an honor it would be to be used to reach into broken lives like these with the Gospel of Grace.
15: Action Steps
As we consider practical and philosophical ways of responding to the above, I believe we should start from a position of corporate repentance. If we wish to truly reach out and touch the lives of broken people in need of a Savior who live a life of same sex attraction or gender dysphoria, we need to begin by recognizing that a great deal of harm, emotional and physical, has been inflicted on this group by the Church for generations. There are homeless people living in our area who were kicked out of their homes by parents holding a Bible. There are those who have been subjected to horrific methods that amount to torture under the guise of “Conversion Therapy” from Christian organizations. The only “conversion” we should concern ourselves with is to a regenerate heart. Attempting to change someone’s sexual attraction is very much beside the point. We cannot hope to be a place where such people can hear about Jesus unless they feel safe to enter our doors. We must also fight the tendency to consider sin in this area as something worse than others, even in non-Christians. James 2 says “…For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it….So speak and so act as those who are to be judged under the law of liberty. For judgment is without mercy to one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.” As we consider corporate and pastoral responses to the argument above, we must start by removing our own planks and repenting for the historical actions of the Church.
Practical steps that we could consider taking would include: removing the statements from the website about marriage and sexuality, especially directly under our Core Beliefs. Again, this is not meant to hide or equivocate on the truth, but not to set such a barrier before someone even walks through our door. Secondly, we should consider how to address these topics within the church. A Sunday morning sermon is not ideal as it is time limited and a unidirectional conversation. A small group course format would be a consideration. We need to equip parents and family members of adolescents, teens, and adults with language to talk about these things in loving, humble, God-honoring ways. In the longer term, we need to consider how we can make our church a place where people would feel comfortable inviting friends and family who look, think and act differently than we do. We need to find a way of projecting safety and inclusion even in our public facing information. This isn’t a balancing act where we must make it clear early and often that we “love the sinner but hate the sin” as the saying goes. We just need to love the sinner. Dealing with the sin can come later God-willing. A third application point is to be mindful of what we say and what we allow to be said without being checked. Certainly, joking at the expense of those who are dealing with these issues is unacceptable, but we also need to work to avoid getting dragged in to pseudo-political discussions on bathroom issues, sports issues or other divisive concerns that have no bearing on the church.
I recognize that these proposals have the potential to divide the church. There are some who may leave the body over these sorts of changes. I would argue that it is our responsibility to them as well as to the unreached in our community to have those discussions and risk some of them leaving over it. These are not all things we should change overnight but after ample opportunities for discussions and prayer.
16: Conclusion – Mark 2:15-17
At its core, these are not issues of who someone loves, sexual attraction, or even specific sex acts. The core is idolatry and identity. When acceptance by others, self-determination, or physical pleasure become the central force driving our lives then we have become idolators. Though our idols take on different shapes, the struggles in this space are shared by all. Whether you are identified by your profession, your family, or your gender identity, you are not being identified by your Master. Building fences around or within the church because someone sins in a different way than us cannot be allowed. Making the excuse that we are somehow “protecting our children” by shielding them from people in our community who desperately need a Savior will not show our children who Jesus is. Within the church, we cannot be afraid to “speak the truth in love.” We need not and cannot shy away from sin in the church, but we must recognize that the Spirit works in each of our lives. Often this happens over a period of time. We should be prepared to walk alongside our brothers and sisters in this journey for as long as they need.
There is a significant correlation between this community and their relationship with religious groups, and the “tax collectors and sinners” that Jesus sought out in His ministry and their relationship with the religious leaders of the day. Our heart should reflect His. Jesus responded: “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.” (Mark 2:17) If our church was filled with transgender people and gay families that loved Jesus, God would be glorified.”
Thank you in advance for any constructive criticism, notes of encouragement to and or reading recommendations on these topics that I can pass along.

Now personally, I think for the purposes of whether or not it’s the answer it depends on what the question is. But there is no realistic expectation of truth in advertising anyway.
But one of the reasons for the backlash, at least according to TYT’s coverage this past Friday, is that with reproductive rights rolled back, abstinence is something some women claim to see as an answer. In and of itself that sounds perfectly valid, but it feels like such a double standard that when men and boys claim they didn’t date in their teen years because they were worried she’d get pregnant and keep the baby even if she said she wouldn’t, and weren’t sure they had the willpower to be abstinent within a relationship, it’s dismissed as incel cope. Well, I remember like yesterday girls who were rumoured to want me back then. Stories on web forums of guys having to drop out to pay child support scared the hell out of me and made me think it not worth it. (Though even before then I was too infatuated with my crushes to go for other girls.)
So why is it so unfathomable that men and boys would be as afraid of lifelong poverty as women and girls are? Or as capable of taking this risk into account? Is the notion that they’re too controlled by their lusts to stay abstinent, even by avoiding dating in the first place? If so, how does one reconcile this with the notion in the context of dress codes or the top free movement that men and boys have as much willpower as women and girls?

A good friend of mine from a fairly conservative evangelical background is considering becoming a pastor at his non-denominational church. As part of the evaluation process, they asked him to write a paper on these topics that he is not an expert on.
He asked for my opinion and I offered to share it online to solicit constructive criticism, notes of encouragement, and or reading recommendations on these topics.
I believe his goal is to be faithful to the scriptures, loving to those outside the church, and challenging to those inside the church, as most of us could do better.
What he wrote is in the quotation marks below.
“1: Scope of the Issue
Sexual immorality has become a besetting and ubiquitous issue in our culture and in our churches. While many aspects of it are not novel or unique to this time and have clear scriptural input, there are others that bring challenges to our church for which we don’t have obvious precedent. The main point of these comments is to try and answer three questions with some degree of specificity: (1) how do we make ourselves a place where people who do not know Christ will feel welcome to come and learn of Him regardless of where they come from, (2) how do we pastorally care for people who have come in to the church with pre-existing circumstances related to sexual immorality, and (3) how do we equip our members to represent Christ to those in their lives that are dealing with these issues. We want to do this in a way that does not “walk a tight rope” or compromise to appease, but honors Scripture in its commands to both show compassion and exhort and correct. We must recognize that every individual circumstance is unique, and many will require careful and prayerful consideration, but this is meant to give a framework for that consideration.
2: Scriptural Basis for Corporate Response
There are many references we can point to that discuss and define sexual immorality throughout Scripture and many of these will be used below as we consider specific examples and situations. Let us start, however, by looking at passages that deal with corporate response rather than individual sin. It is clear that the Corinthian church had significant issues in this area, and much of Paul’s first letter was devoted to it. In chapter 5, Paul states that when sexual immorality is discovered in the church we should “mourn” over it and “not to associate with immoral people.” Importantly, he also makes clear in vv. 9-13 that these comments only apply to those “who bears the name of brother.” He explicitly writes, “not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world…for what have I to do with judging outsiders?” This is key in informing our response to those who are not members of the church. If it is our desire to see sinners come through our doors and come to know our Savior through our ministry, then we must be welcoming, accepting them where they are. This is not to say we hide or compromise the biblical position, but it is not an issue on which we want to filter people at the door. There are three categories of people in sexual sin that we need to form a response for. First, those just coming to the church who have not committed to it – these should be treated the same as any we are reaching out to with Christ’s love. They need Jesus, not behavioral change. Next, those who have recently joined the church but have pre-existing sexual sin patterns. This can and should be addressed with patience, dignity, and love. There are often many sin areas in the life of a new believer, and it is prudent to discern how and when to address each of them. Lastly, those who have been members in the church for some amount of time and fall into sexual sin. This is the group that Paul is primarily addressing in 1 Corinthians. While sex within marriage is a private issue, sexual sin cannot be a taboo topic. It needs to be addressed regularly and clearly. We need close enough relationships within the church that such problems do not fester in the dark. We must avoid the typical church pattern to vilify the first group, never see the second group, and pretend the third group doesn’t exist until it all blows up in scandal. May it never be.
3: Consistency Issue
There is a tendency in our Christian culture to treat some sexual sins as worse than others. Like the Corinthians, some things we seem to have accepted as just ubiquitous parts of our culture. Knowing the prevalence of promiscuity and fornication among teens and single adults and usage of pornography even within the church, we tend to address these as issues of indwelling sin, similar to anger or fear of man, with offers of accountability and understanding when someone falls. By contrast, when it comes to homosexuality or adultery, it is often a church discipline issue. We view homosexual marriage as a major problem, but remarriage after a non-biblical divorce is rarely addressed. These inconsistencies lead to stigmatization and polarization and should have no place in the church. The criterion for escalation should be unrepentance, not the nature of the sexual sin. It is clear from 1 Corinthians that all should be taken seriously, but none should be vilified above others.
4: Culture and Identity
The major underlying problem with many of the sexual sin and gender issues is that they have come to be culturally bound up with people’s identities. This is not a new phenomenon and is not unique to this issue. As far back as Acts 19, you see people becoming “enraged” because Paul had threatened the Ephesians’ cultural identity as worshipers of Artemis. People continue to find their primary identities in their employment, hobbies, sports teams, or families rather than Christ. None of these should be accepted, but none should be reviled either. If a person does not know Jesus, they are dead. How they identify themselves is of no concern. Once they have been made alive, they can be taught that “whose” they are is more important than “who” they are. All identity outside of Christ is not sinful, but if it takes paramount importance, it may become so. A person who recognizes a tendency toward same sex attraction may label themselves as gay or lesbian. This should not be considered a sin issue unless it becomes, for them, their defining characteristic or leads to sinful actions. We should recognize the difficulty of this struggle and support such a person rather than get hung up on labels. There must be clear distinction between identifying same sex attraction and engaging in homosexual behavior. These should be the guiding principles underlying everything that follows are regards individual cases.
5: Public Facing Information, Guests, and New Attendees
Considering what we have discussed, and Paul’s assertion in 1 Corinthians 5 that we ought to reserve judgment on sexual immorality to those we call brother, I would submit that public facing information regarding the church (i.e. website, app, etc) should not publish a position on sexual immorality, marriage, and gender identity. Doing so effectively places the filter at the door so that people who do not know Christ may be turned away from it. This is not tantamount to tacit approval. In appropriate contexts within the church, these topics should still be discussed and addressed, but I do not believe it is consistent with a biblical treatment of unbelievers to place it in a public facing forum. If we have guests or new regular attendees who appear to be engaged in a cohabitating or fornicating relationship, a homosexual relationship, or other sexual sin, this should not be a priority to address unless we have discerned that they are believers and join the church. Even then, it is important to draw a distinction between someone who deals with same-sex attraction and someone who engages in homosexual behavior. The next seven points are meant to discuss, in broad terms, how we should address those who join the church with pre-existing relationships or identity issues:
6: Promiscuity, Cohabitation – Hebrews 13:4, 1 Cor 7:1-2, Ex 22:16
Much of the biblical discussion on promiscuity is by inference. Clearly, sex was meant to be inseparably linked to marriage and outside of that context should be considered immoral. For those who join the church already in a sexual relationship who are unmarried we should apply Exodus 22:16 and encourage them to marry as soon as possible. If they do not wish to marry, they should be encouraged to separate. Paul acknowledges in 1 Cor 7:2 that marriage is the best remedy for “temptation to sexual immorality.”
7: Adultery, Divorce and Remarriage – Matt 5:32, Matt 19:9, 1 Cor 7:10-11
This issue is given much more explicit biblical instruction but is often glossed over in our Christian culture due to the messy landscape of divorces and remarriages. In cases where non-biblical divorce has occurred, if reconciliation is possible, this should be pursued. If reconciliation is impossible because one or more parties have remarried, it would not be sensible to divorce again in order to achieve reconciliation. The principle to apply here, I believe, is from 1 Cor 7:17-24 summarized in verse 20: “Each one should remain in the condition in which he was called.” This is not an ideal circumstance, but it is the best way forward in an imperfect world. Of note, polygamy was common in the culture of the early church, and while not ideal, was accepted by the church, as evidenced by the qualifications for elder to be “a husband of but one wife.” We have polygamous cultures even within our local community and if they came to Christ, we should not counsel them to divorce all but one wife and thus disrupt their social structure. It is not ideal and would disqualify them from eldership, but they should remain as they are. Whether marriage after unbiblical divorce in the past disqualifies a man from eldership is a case-by case question for the eldership.
8: Pornography, Sensuality, and Lust – Lev 18:6-18, Matt 5:28
As mentioned above, use of pornography has reached a high saturation point within our culture and within our church. While once thought of as simply a male issue, there is a growing trend toward gender parity in pornography usage. It is an issue that should be discussed with some frequency within our church. For those that join the church and view pornography regularly, it needs to be made clear that while the world has largely destigmatized it, it is still sexual immorality. Furthermore, this isn’t just limited to nudity and pornography, but any sensuality that leads to looking at someone “with lustful intent” is the heart equivalent of adultery according to Matt 5:28. In our culture, it is not possible to avoid such things by just turning away. We need to address the heart issues of idolatry, selfishness, and satisfaction in Christ. Practically, how should we deal with those who have on-going struggles with pornography, sensuality and lust? Should this preclude them from eldership? From deaconship? Taken strictly, this would preclude nearly all men from eldership. These require individual evaluation from the elders, but a guiding principle should be, if the person is repentant and there is evidence of growth in their life, we should consider more responsibility and continued discipleship.
9: Homosexuality – Lev 18:22, Lev 20:13, 1 Cor 6:9, 1 Tim 1:8-11
From the above references and others, it is evident that homosexual behavior is sexual sin. We cannot equivocate on that point. As we have discussed above, if a person who is already a believer and in the church and struggles with same sex attraction, we should approach them as we would handle anyone who is sexually attracted to someone to whom they are not married. If such a person decides that homosexuality is not sinful and begins sexually immoral activity, we should deal with them in the same way as any member who falls into unrepentant sin and go through the processes of correction and, if necessary, of church discipline. It is important that we draw a distinction between same sex attraction and homosexual behavior. We can do tremendous harm by demonizing same sex attraction and creating a taboo around it. A person who is struggling to abstain from homosexual behavior should be supported and encouraged. I believe Paul’s strong statements about not associating with sexually immoral people applies to those who remain unrepentant. Much more nuanced is the issue of how we address those that join the church already in a homosexual relationship. What about the married homosexual couple who join the church with their adopted child? Should we break up their family? I believe, in this case, the same principle should apply as to those who have gone through an unbiblical divorce in the past. We should apply 1 Cor 7:20: “Each one should remain in the condition in which he was called.” We can recognize that this is not ideal, but it is the best we can do in a fallen world just as we do with someone who is married after unbiblical divorce. Whether should apply to a homosexual couple in a long term committed relationship who are not legally married would be an individual discussion with the elders. Again, these are nuanced cases that will need individual prayer, discussion, and discernment. I believe a great deal more patience is called for when a new believer joins the church that has a history or present reality of homosexuality, even if they are unrepentant at first, believing that homosexuality is not sinful, than we would demonstrate to a person who has been in the church for a period of time and then decides to pursue a homosexual relationship.
10: Bisexuality – Heb 13:4
Bisexual attraction is no more or less of an issue than anyone who finds that they are sexually attracted to someone other than their spouse. This is not a rare or unique circumstance, even within the church. Someone who is practicing bisexuality is, by definition, not confining sex to the marriage bed, and this, therefore, qualifies as sexual immorality. The issue, here again, is one of identity and cultural acceptance. If a person “identifies as bisexual,” the real issue is not the bisexuality, but the fact that they identify themselves primarily by their sexual desires, and not by Christ. It would be equally a problem if they “identified as heterosexual” and that was seen as their defining characteristic. If such a person were to join the church, our priority should be in helping them see their identity in Christ rather than focusing on renouncing their sexual preference.
11: Transgenderism/Non-binarism – Psalm 139: 13-15
It should be noted that the next two points should not be considered in the category of sexual immorality, but as they are connected to the same cultural moment will be discussed here. It should further be remarked that transgenderism is a modern issue with no direct reference in Scripture. It is a challenging issue that often falls prey to oversimplification and scapegoating. It is not sufficient to simply state that a person should identify with their born gender. There are those born with ambiguous genitalia and those born with sex chromosome abnormalities such that “born gender” is not necessarily accurate. These occur with a frequency of 1 in 448 births on average which is not particularly rare. The majority of people who consider themselves to be transgender do not fall into these categories, but the fact remains that these categories exist. Unless we plan to embark on genetic testing, we must be careful how we assert someone’s gender assignment. Furthermore, we must acknowledge that much of the gender confusion in our culture is due to a distortion of biblically accurate masculinity and femininity in our culture of which the church has been widely supportive for generations. Many transgender and non-binary individuals consider themselves so because they do not fit into the traditional boxes our culture has created for the genders. The church can start by recognizing that these boxes are incorrect. We can also acknowledge that gender differences and roles are far less important than most human cultures perceive. Christ himself challenged many gender norms in his ministry and Paul maintains “…there is no male or female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.” (Gal 3:28b) It is much more difficult to recognize this issue as a sin issue than many of the above concerns. If someone wishes to be addressed by different pronouns than they once did or dress differently than they once did, this does not amount to immorality. Once again, this can be an idolatrous identity issue if the person sees it as the central characteristic of their lives. There is often an inherent pride in asserting that such a person does not feel they fit in the body created for them, but if they come to love Jesus and understand and believe that they are “fearfully and wonderfully made” then this issue may become moot. Whether or not they revert to dressing differently or using pronouns they did when they were younger is largely immaterial. This also addresses the issue of people who may have undergone permanent physical changes. While we should not endorse such modification if it is being considered, there is no reason to reverse such a thing in order to return to a base state. We must recognize that this is a group that has a high propensity toward mental health concerns, instability, and suicidality. They need love, support and prayer, not scapegoating and extra-biblical expectations of conforming to a cultural norm. We must further note that this group as well as the homosexual group have often experienced psychological and even physical harm from others in our culture, sometimes in the name of Christ. We must foster an environment of champions physical and psychological safety for these people.
12: Asexuality – 1 Cor 7:25-38
Asexuality also should not be considered sexual immorality. There is, in fact, wide support in Paul’s letters such as in 1 Cor 7 for people, if they are able, to remain unmarried and be “anxious about the things of the Lord, how to please the Lord.” We tend to champion the model of the nuclear family in our Christian culture, but Paul sees chaste singleness as a better way. There should be no pressure from the church to make sure that single people pair off and get married because it is expected of them. As this state has been culturally identified with the LGBTQIA movement, it is seen on the same spectrum as the sexual immorality and gender issues discussed above, but it is not. It can still fall prey to the same issue of an idolatrous identity as some of the above issues, but it need not be so.
13: Glass Ceiling
In the event that God sees fit to bring people from these subgroups into our church, there would inevitably be a glass ceiling. The question is at what point. The four logical points are: regular attender, member, deacon, and elder. Regardless of their background or position, all should be welcome to be a regular attender. It is also clear, from the biblical requirements for eldership, that on-going problems or engagement in any of the sexual sins would disqualify them from that post. The middle two are less clear. I would submit that the bar for membership should be very low. This step, in my opinion, is when they would “bear the name of brother” and not before. Even if they disagree about the sinful nature of homosexuality, this should not disallow them from becoming members as long as they agree to submit to the churches position and not cause division. Allowing them to become members gives us the pastoral authority to speak into their lives, and we would hope that over time the Spirit would work in their hearts to convince them of the truth. Putting such a person in a deacon role would probably not be wise but would need to be evaluated prayerfully on a case-by-case basis. The difficulty here is that, while a position on homosexuality is not a salvific issue and should not be considered a core doctrine in the same way as the deity of Christ, for example, it is a sin issue. There is a limit to how far we can “agree to disagree” and still uphold our duty to root out sin in our midst. Once again, we should also distinguish between a struggle with same sex attraction and engagement in homosexual behavior when we consider our response. There is also a glass ceiling when it comes to marriage. While I believe we should not break up existing homosexual marriages, we should not participate in creating them. The marriage covenant between a man and woman was created, in part, to reflect the relationship between Christ and the church (Eph 5). This should not be co-opted to excuse or normalize immorality.
14: Nuance and Edge Cases
The above outline is by no means meant to be exhaustive or definitive. It is meant to provide a lens, supported by scripture, through which we can view these issues and consider corporate and pastoral responses. It should inform how we view the people that walk through the door from a wide range of backgrounds and how we equip those in our church to be Christ’s ambassadors to those in our community. Every person and circumstance, history and baggage will be different, and any non-nuanced position would be inherently evil. I pray we have many opportunities to talk, think and pray through specific situations that God would bless us with the chance to be a part of. What an honor it would be to be used to reach into broken lives like these with the Gospel of Grace.
15: Action Steps
As we consider practical and philosophical ways of responding to the above, I believe we should start from a position of corporate repentance. If we wish to truly reach out and touch the lives of broken people in need of a Savior who live a life of same sex attraction or gender dysphoria, we need to begin by recognizing that a great deal of harm, emotional and physical, has been inflicted on this group by the Church for generations. There are homeless people living in our area who were kicked out of their homes by parents holding a Bible. There are those who have been subjected to horrific methods that amount to torture under the guise of “Conversion Therapy” from Christian organizations. The only “conversion” we should concern ourselves with is to a regenerate heart. Attempting to change someone’s sexual attraction is very much beside the point. We cannot hope to be a place where such people can hear about Jesus unless they feel safe to enter our doors. We must also fight the tendency to consider sin in this area as something worse than others, even in non-Christians. James 2 says “…For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it….So speak and so act as those who are to be judged under the law of liberty. For judgment is without mercy to one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.” As we consider corporate and pastoral responses to the argument above, we must start by removing our own planks and repenting for the historical actions of the Church.
Practical steps that we could consider taking would include: removing the statements from the website about marriage and sexuality, especially directly under our Core Beliefs. Again, this is not meant to hide or equivocate on the truth, but not to set such a barrier before someone even walks through our door. Secondly, we should consider how to address these topics within the church. A Sunday morning sermon is not ideal as it is time limited and a unidirectional conversation. A small group course format would be a consideration. We need to equip parents and family members of adolescents, teens, and adults with language to talk about these things in loving, humble, God-honoring ways. In the longer term, we need to consider how we can make our church a place where people would feel comfortable inviting friends and family who look, think and act differently than we do. We need to find a way of projecting safety and inclusion even in our public facing information. This isn’t a balancing act where we must make it clear early and often that we “love the sinner but hate the sin” as the saying goes. We just need to love the sinner. Dealing with the sin can come later God-willing. A third application point is to be mindful of what we say and what we allow to be said without being checked. Certainly, joking at the expense of those who are dealing with these issues is unacceptable, but we also need to work to avoid getting dragged in to pseudo-political discussions on bathroom issues, sports issues or other divisive concerns that have no bearing on the church.
I recognize that these proposals have the potential to divide the church. There are some who may leave the body over these sorts of changes. I would argue that it is our responsibility to them as well as to the unreached in our community to have those discussions and risk some of them leaving over it. These are not all things we should change overnight but after ample opportunities for discussions and prayer.
16: Conclusion – Mark 2:15-17
At its core, these are not issues of who someone loves, sexual attraction, or even specific sex acts. The core is idolatry and identity. When acceptance by others, self-determination, or physical pleasure become the central force driving our lives then we have become idolators. Though our idols take on different shapes, the struggles in this space are shared by all. Whether you are identified by your profession, your family, or your gender identity, you are not being identified by your Master. Building fences around or within the church because someone sins in a different way than us cannot be allowed. Making the excuse that we are somehow “protecting our children” by shielding them from people in our community who desperately need a Savior will not show our children who Jesus is. Within the church, we cannot be afraid to “speak the truth in love.” We need not and cannot shy away from sin in the church, but we must recognize that the Spirit works in each of our lives. Often this happens over a period of time. We should be prepared to walk alongside our brothers and sisters in this journey for as long as they need.
There is a significant correlation between this community and their relationship with religious groups, and the “tax collectors and sinners” that Jesus sought out in His ministry and their relationship with the religious leaders of the day. Our heart should reflect His. Jesus responded: “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.” (Mark 2:17) If our church was filled with transgender people and gay families that loved Jesus, God would be glorified.”
Thank you in advance for any constructive criticism, notes of encouragement and or reading recommendations on these topics that I can pass along.

A good friend of mine from a fairly conservative evangelical background is considering becoming a pastor at his non-denominational church. As part of the evaluation process, they asked him to write a paper on these topics that he is not an expert on.
He asked for my opinion and I offered to share it online to solicit constructive criticism, notes of encouragement, and or reading recommendations on these topics.
I believe his goal is to be faithful to the scriptures, loving to those outside the church, and challenging to those inside the church, as most of us could do better.
What he wrote is in the quotation marks below.
“1: Scope of the Issue
Sexual immorality has become a besetting and ubiquitous issue in our culture and in our churches. While many aspects of it are not novel or unique to this time and have clear scriptural input, there are others that bring challenges to our church for which we don’t have obvious precedent. The main point of these comments is to try and answer three questions with some degree of specificity: (1) how do we make ourselves a place where people who do not know Christ will feel welcome to come and learn of Him regardless of where they come from, (2) how do we pastorally care for people who have come in to the church with pre-existing circumstances related to sexual immorality, and (3) how do we equip our members to represent Christ to those in their lives that are dealing with these issues. We want to do this in a way that does not “walk a tight rope” or compromise to appease, but honors Scripture in its commands to both show compassion and exhort and correct. We must recognize that every individual circumstance is unique, and many will require careful and prayerful consideration, but this is meant to give a framework for that consideration.
2: Scriptural Basis for Corporate Response
There are many references we can point to that discuss and define sexual immorality throughout Scripture and many of these will be used below as we consider specific examples and situations. Let us start, however, by looking at passages that deal with corporate response rather than individual sin. It is clear that the Corinthian church had significant issues in this area, and much of Paul’s first letter was devoted to it. In chapter 5, Paul states that when sexual immorality is discovered in the church we should “mourn” over it and “not to associate with immoral people.” Importantly, he also makes clear in vv. 9-13 that these comments only apply to those “who bears the name of brother.” He explicitly writes, “not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world…for what have I to do with judging outsiders?” This is key in informing our response to those who are not members of the church. If it is our desire to see sinners come through our doors and come to know our Savior through our ministry, then we must be welcoming, accepting them where they are. This is not to say we hide or compromise the biblical position, but it is not an issue on which we want to filter people at the door. There are three categories of people in sexual sin that we need to form a response for. First, those just coming to the church who have not committed to it – these should be treated the same as any we are reaching out to with Christ’s love. They need Jesus, not behavioral change. Next, those who have recently joined the church but have pre-existing sexual sin patterns. This can and should be addressed with patience, dignity, and love. There are often many sin areas in the life of a new believer, and it is prudent to discern how and when to address each of them. Lastly, those who have been members in the church for some amount of time and fall into sexual sin. This is the group that Paul is primarily addressing in 1 Corinthians. While sex within marriage is a private issue, sexual sin cannot be a taboo topic. It needs to be addressed regularly and clearly. We need close enough relationships within the church that such problems do not fester in the dark. We must avoid the typical church pattern to vilify the first group, never see the second group, and pretend the third group doesn’t exist until it all blows up in scandal. May it never be.
3: Consistency Issue
There is a tendency in our Christian culture to treat some sexual sins as worse than others. Like the Corinthians, some things we seem to have accepted as just ubiquitous parts of our culture. Knowing the prevalence of promiscuity and fornication among teens and single adults and usage of pornography even within the church, we tend to address these as issues of indwelling sin, similar to anger or fear of man, with offers of accountability and understanding when someone falls. By contrast, when it comes to homosexuality or adultery, it is often a church discipline issue. We view homosexual marriage as a major problem, but remarriage after a non-biblical divorce is rarely addressed. These inconsistencies lead to stigmatization and polarization and should have no place in the church. The criterion for escalation should be unrepentance, not the nature of the sexual sin. It is clear from 1 Corinthians that all should be taken seriously, but none should be vilified above others.
4: Culture and Identity
The major underlying problem with many of the sexual sin and gender issues is that they have come to be culturally bound up with people’s identities. This is not a new phenomenon and is not unique to this issue. As far back as Acts 19, you see people becoming “enraged” because Paul had threatened the Ephesians’ cultural identity as worshipers of Artemis. People continue to find their primary identities in their employment, hobbies, sports teams, or families rather than Christ. None of these should be accepted, but none should be reviled either. If a person does not know Jesus, they are dead. How they identify themselves is of no concern. Once they have been made alive, they can be taught that “whose” they are is more important than “who” they are. All identity outside of Christ is not sinful, but if it takes paramount importance, it may become so. A person who recognizes a tendency toward same sex attraction may label themselves as gay or lesbian. This should not be considered a sin issue unless it becomes, for them, their defining characteristic or leads to sinful actions. We should recognize the difficulty of this struggle and support such a person rather than get hung up on labels. There must be clear distinction between identifying same sex attraction and engaging in homosexual behavior. These should be the guiding principles underlying everything that follows are regards individual cases.
5: Public Facing Information, Guests, and New Attendees
Considering what we have discussed, and Paul’s assertion in 1 Corinthians 5 that we ought to reserve judgment on sexual immorality to those we call brother, I would submit that public facing information regarding the church (i.e. website, app, etc) should not publish a position on sexual immorality, marriage, and gender identity. Doing so effectively places the filter at the door so that people who do not know Christ may be turned away from it. This is not tantamount to tacit approval. In appropriate contexts within the church, these topics should still be discussed and addressed, but I do not believe it is consistent with a biblical treatment of unbelievers to place it in a public facing forum. If we have guests or new regular attendees who appear to be engaged in a cohabitating or fornicating relationship, a homosexual relationship, or other sexual sin, this should not be a priority to address unless we have discerned that they are believers and join the church. Even then, it is important to draw a distinction between someone who deals with same-sex attraction and someone who engages in homosexual behavior. The next seven points are meant to discuss, in broad terms, how we should address those who join the church with pre-existing relationships or identity issues:
6: Promiscuity, Cohabitation – Hebrews 13:4, 1 Cor 7:1-2, Ex 22:16
Much of the biblical discussion on promiscuity is by inference. Clearly, sex was meant to be inseparably linked to marriage and outside of that context should be considered immoral. For those who join the church already in a sexual relationship who are unmarried we should apply Exodus 22:16 and encourage them to marry as soon as possible. If they do not wish to marry, they should be encouraged to separate. Paul acknowledges in 1 Cor 7:2 that marriage is the best remedy for “temptation to sexual immorality.”
7: Adultery, Divorce and Remarriage – Matt 5:32, Matt 19:9, 1 Cor 7:10-11
This issue is given much more explicit biblical instruction but is often glossed over in our Christian culture due to the messy landscape of divorces and remarriages. In cases where non-biblical divorce has occurred, if reconciliation is possible, this should be pursued. If reconciliation is impossible because one or more parties have remarried, it would not be sensible to divorce again in order to achieve reconciliation. The principle to apply here, I believe, is from 1 Cor 7:17-24 summarized in verse 20: “Each one should remain in the condition in which he was called.” This is not an ideal circumstance, but it is the best way forward in an imperfect world. Of note, polygamy was common in the culture of the early church, and while not ideal, was accepted by the church, as evidenced by the qualifications for elder to be “a husband of but one wife.” We have polygamous cultures even within our local community and if they came to Christ, we should not counsel them to divorce all but one wife and thus disrupt their social structure. It is not ideal and would disqualify them from eldership, but they should remain as they are. Whether marriage after unbiblical divorce in the past disqualifies a man from eldership is a case-by case question for the eldership.
8: Pornography, Sensuality, and Lust – Lev 18:6-18, Matt 5:28
As mentioned above, use of pornography has reached a high saturation point within our culture and within our church. While once thought of as simply a male issue, there is a growing trend toward gender parity in pornography usage. It is an issue that should be discussed with some frequency within our church. For those that join the church and view pornography regularly, it needs to be made clear that while the world has largely destigmatized it, it is still sexual immorality. Furthermore, this isn’t just limited to nudity and pornography, but any sensuality that leads to looking at someone “with lustful intent” is the heart equivalent of adultery according to Matt 5:28. In our culture, it is not possible to avoid such things by just turning away. We need to address the heart issues of idolatry, selfishness, and satisfaction in Christ. Practically, how should we deal with those who have on-going struggles with pornography, sensuality and lust? Should this preclude them from eldership? From deaconship? Taken strictly, this would preclude nearly all men from eldership. These require individual evaluation from the elders, but a guiding principle should be, if the person is repentant and there is evidence of growth in their life, we should consider more responsibility and continued discipleship.
9: Homosexuality – Lev 18:22, Lev 20:13, 1 Cor 6:9, 1 Tim 1:8-11
From the above references and others, it is evident that homosexual behavior is sexual sin. We cannot equivocate on that point. As we have discussed above, if a person who is already a believer and in the church and struggles with same sex attraction, we should approach them as we would handle anyone who is sexually attracted to someone to whom they are not married. If such a person decides that homosexuality is not sinful and begins sexually immoral activity, we should deal with them in the same way as any member who falls into unrepentant sin and go through the processes of correction and, if necessary, of church discipline. It is important that we draw a distinction between same sex attraction and homosexual behavior. We can do tremendous harm by demonizing same sex attraction and creating a taboo around it. A person who is struggling to abstain from homosexual behavior should be supported and encouraged. I believe Paul’s strong statements about not associating with sexually immoral people applies to those who remain unrepentant. Much more nuanced is the issue of how we address those that join the church already in a homosexual relationship. What about the married homosexual couple who join the church with their adopted child? Should we break up their family? I believe, in this case, the same principle should apply as to those who have gone through an unbiblical divorce in the past. We should apply 1 Cor 7:20: “Each one should remain in the condition in which he was called.” We can recognize that this is not ideal, but it is the best we can do in a fallen world just as we do with someone who is married after unbiblical divorce. Whether should apply to a homosexual couple in a long term committed relationship who are not legally married would be an individual discussion with the elders. Again, these are nuanced cases that will need individual prayer, discussion, and discernment. I believe a great deal more patience is called for when a new believer joins the church that has a history or present reality of homosexuality, even if they are unrepentant at first, believing that homosexuality is not sinful, than we would demonstrate to a person who has been in the church for a period of time and then decides to pursue a homosexual relationship.
10: Bisexuality – Heb 13:4
Bisexual attraction is no more or less of an issue than anyone who finds that they are sexually attracted to someone other than their spouse. This is not a rare or unique circumstance, even within the church. Someone who is practicing bisexuality is, by definition, not confining sex to the marriage bed, and this, therefore, qualifies as sexual immorality. The issue, here again, is one of identity and cultural acceptance. If a person “identifies as bisexual,” the real issue is not the bisexuality, but the fact that they identify themselves primarily by their sexual desires, and not by Christ. It would be equally a problem if they “identified as heterosexual” and that was seen as their defining characteristic. If such a person were to join the church, our priority should be in helping them see their identity in Christ rather than focusing on renouncing their sexual preference.
11: Transgenderism/Non-binarism – Psalm 139: 13-15
It should be noted that the next two points should not be considered in the category of sexual immorality, but as they are connected to the same cultural moment will be discussed here. It should further be remarked that transgenderism is a modern issue with no direct reference in Scripture. It is a challenging issue that often falls prey to oversimplification and scapegoating. It is not sufficient to simply state that a person should identify with their born gender. There are those born with ambiguous genitalia and those born with sex chromosome abnormalities such that “born gender” is not necessarily accurate. These occur with a frequency of 1 in 448 births on average which is not particularly rare. The majority of people who consider themselves to be transgender do not fall into these categories, but the fact remains that these categories exist. Unless we plan to embark on genetic testing, we must be careful how we assert someone’s gender assignment. Furthermore, we must acknowledge that much of the gender confusion in our culture is due to a distortion of biblically accurate masculinity and femininity in our culture of which the church has been widely supportive for generations. Many transgender and non-binary individuals consider themselves so because they do not fit into the traditional boxes our culture has created for the genders. The church can start by recognizing that these boxes are incorrect. We can also acknowledge that gender differences and roles are far less important than most human cultures perceive. Christ himself challenged many gender norms in his ministry and Paul maintains “…there is no male or female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.” (Gal 3:28b) It is much more difficult to recognize this issue as a sin issue than many of the above concerns. If someone wishes to be addressed by different pronouns than they once did or dress differently than they once did, this does not amount to immorality. Once again, this can be an idolatrous identity issue if the person sees it as the central characteristic of their lives. There is often an inherent pride in asserting that such a person does not feel they fit in the body created for them, but if they come to love Jesus and understand and believe that they are “fearfully and wonderfully made” then this issue may become moot. Whether or not they revert to dressing differently or using pronouns they did when they were younger is largely immaterial. This also addresses the issue of people who may have undergone permanent physical changes. While we should not endorse such modification if it is being considered, there is no reason to reverse such a thing in order to return to a base state. We must recognize that this is a group that has a high propensity toward mental health concerns, instability, and suicidality. They need love, support and prayer, not scapegoating and extra-biblical expectations of conforming to a cultural norm. We must further note that this group as well as the homosexual group have often experienced psychological and even physical harm from others in our culture, sometimes in the name of Christ. We must foster an environment of champions physical and psychological safety for these people.
12: Asexuality – 1 Cor 7:25-38
Asexuality also should not be considered sexual immorality. There is, in fact, wide support in Paul’s letters such as in 1 Cor 7 for people, if they are able, to remain unmarried and be “anxious about the things of the Lord, how to please the Lord.” We tend to champion the model of the nuclear family in our Christian culture, but Paul sees chaste singleness as a better way. There should be no pressure from the church to make sure that single people pair off and get married because it is expected of them. As this state has been culturally identified with the LGBTQIA movement, it is seen on the same spectrum as the sexual immorality and gender issues discussed above, but it is not. It can still fall prey to the same issue of an idolatrous identity as some of the above issues, but it need not be so.
13: Glass Ceiling
In the event that God sees fit to bring people from these subgroups into our church, there would inevitably be a glass ceiling. The question is at what point. The four logical points are: regular attender, member, deacon, and elder. Regardless of their background or position, all should be welcome to be a regular attender. It is also clear, from the biblical requirements for eldership, that on-going problems or engagement in any of the sexual sins would disqualify them from that post. The middle two are less clear. I would submit that the bar for membership should be very low. This step, in my opinion, is when they would “bear the name of brother” and not before. Even if they disagree about the sinful nature of homosexuality, this should not disallow them from becoming members as long as they agree to submit to the churches position and not cause division. Allowing them to become members gives us the pastoral authority to speak into their lives, and we would hope that over time the Spirit would work in their hearts to convince them of the truth. Putting such a person in a deacon role would probably not be wise but would need to be evaluated prayerfully on a case-by-case basis. The difficulty here is that, while a position on homosexuality is not a salvific issue and should not be considered a core doctrine in the same way as the deity of Christ, for example, it is a sin issue. There is a limit to how far we can “agree to disagree” and still uphold our duty to root out sin in our midst. Once again, we should also distinguish between a struggle with same sex attraction and engagement in homosexual behavior when we consider our response. There is also a glass ceiling when it comes to marriage. While I believe we should not break up existing homosexual marriages, we should not participate in creating them. The marriage covenant between a man and woman was created, in part, to reflect the relationship between Christ and the church (Eph 5). This should not be co-opted to excuse or normalize immorality.
14: Nuance and Edge Cases
The above outline is by no means meant to be exhaustive or definitive. It is meant to provide a lens, supported by scripture, through which we can view these issues and consider corporate and pastoral responses. It should inform how we view the people that walk through the door from a wide range of backgrounds and how we equip those in our church to be Christ’s ambassadors to those in our community. Every person and circumstance, history and baggage will be different, and any non-nuanced position would be inherently evil. I pray we have many opportunities to talk, think and pray through specific situations that God would bless us with the chance to be a part of. What an honor it would be to be used to reach into broken lives like these with the Gospel of Grace.
15: Action Steps
As we consider practical and philosophical ways of responding to the above, I believe we should start from a position of corporate repentance. If we wish to truly reach out and touch the lives of broken people in need of a Savior who live a life of same sex attraction or gender dysphoria, we need to begin by recognizing that a great deal of harm, emotional and physical, has been inflicted on this group by the Church for generations. There are homeless people living in our area who were kicked out of their homes by parents holding a Bible. There are those who have been subjected to horrific methods that amount to torture under the guise of “Conversion Therapy” from Christian organizations. The only “conversion” we should concern ourselves with is to a regenerate heart. Attempting to change someone’s sexual attraction is very much beside the point. We cannot hope to be a place where such people can hear about Jesus unless they feel safe to enter our doors. We must also fight the tendency to consider sin in this area as something worse than others, even in non-Christians. James 2 says “…For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it….So speak and so act as those who are to be judged under the law of liberty. For judgment is without mercy to one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.” As we consider corporate and pastoral responses to the argument above, we must start by removing our own planks and repenting for the historical actions of the Church.
Practical steps that we could consider taking would include: removing the statements from the website about marriage and sexuality, especially directly under our Core Beliefs. Again, this is not meant to hide or equivocate on the truth, but not to set such a barrier before someone even walks through our door. Secondly, we should consider how to address these topics within the church. A Sunday morning sermon is not ideal as it is time limited and a unidirectional conversation. A small group course format would be a consideration. We need to equip parents and family members of adolescents, teens, and adults with language to talk about these things in loving, humble, God-honoring ways. In the longer term, we need to consider how we can make our church a place where people would feel comfortable inviting friends and family who look, think and act differently than we do. We need to find a way of projecting safety and inclusion even in our public facing information. This isn’t a balancing act where we must make it clear early and often that we “love the sinner but hate the sin” as the saying goes. We just need to love the sinner. Dealing with the sin can come later God-willing. A third application point is to be mindful of what we say and what we allow to be said without being checked. Certainly, joking at the expense of those who are dealing with these issues is unacceptable, but we also need to work to avoid getting dragged in to pseudo-political discussions on bathroom issues, sports issues or other divisive concerns that have no bearing on the church.
I recognize that these proposals have the potential to divide the church. There are some who may leave the body over these sorts of changes. I would argue that it is our responsibility to them as well as to the unreached in our community to have those discussions and risk some of them leaving over it. These are not all things we should change overnight but after ample opportunities for discussions and prayer.
16: Conclusion – Mark 2:15-17
At its core, these are not issues of who someone loves, sexual attraction, or even specific sex acts. The core is idolatry and identity. When acceptance by others, self-determination, or physical pleasure become the central force driving our lives then we have become idolators. Though our idols take on different shapes, the struggles in this space are shared by all. Whether you are identified by your profession, your family, or your gender identity, you are not being identified by your Master. Building fences around or within the church because someone sins in a different way than us cannot be allowed. Making the excuse that we are somehow “protecting our children” by shielding them from people in our community who desperately need a Savior will not show our children who Jesus is. Within the church, we cannot be afraid to “speak the truth in love.” We need not and cannot shy away from sin in the church, but we must recognize that the Spirit works in each of our lives. Often this happens over a period of time. We should be prepared to walk alongside our brothers and sisters in this journey for as long as they need.
There is a significant correlation between this community and their relationship with religious groups, and the “tax collectors and sinners” that Jesus sought out in His ministry and their relationship with the religious leaders of the day. Our heart should reflect His. Jesus responded: “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.” (Mark 2:17) If our church was filled with transgender people and gay families that loved Jesus, God would be glorified.”
Thank you in advance for any constructive criticism, notes of encouragement and or reading recommendations on these topics that I can pass along.

A good friend of mine from a fairly conservative evangelical background is considering becoming a pastor at his non-denominational church. As part of the evaluation process, they asked him to write a paper on these topics that he is not an expert on.
He asked for my opinion and I offered to share it online to solicit constructive criticism, notes of encouragement, and or reading recommendations on these topics.
I believe his goal is to be faithful to the scriptures, loving to those outside the church, and challenging to those inside the church, as most of us could do better.
What he wrote is in the quotation marks below.
“1: Scope of the Issue
Sexual immorality has become a besetting and ubiquitous issue in our culture and in our churches. While many aspects of it are not novel or unique to this time and have clear scriptural input, there are others that bring challenges to our church for which we don’t have obvious precedent. The main point of these comments is to try and answer three questions with some degree of specificity: (1) how do we make ourselves a place where people who do not know Christ will feel welcome to come and learn of Him regardless of where they come from, (2) how do we pastorally care for people who have come in to the church with pre-existing circumstances related to sexual immorality, and (3) how do we equip our members to represent Christ to those in their lives that are dealing with these issues. We want to do this in a way that does not “walk a tight rope” or compromise to appease, but honors Scripture in its commands to both show compassion and exhort and correct. We must recognize that every individual circumstance is unique, and many will require careful and prayerful consideration, but this is meant to give a framework for that consideration.
2: Scriptural Basis for Corporate Response
There are many references we can point to that discuss and define sexual immorality throughout Scripture and many of these will be used below as we consider specific examples and situations. Let us start, however, by looking at passages that deal with corporate response rather than individual sin. It is clear that the Corinthian church had significant issues in this area, and much of Paul’s first letter was devoted to it. In chapter 5, Paul states that when sexual immorality is discovered in the church we should “mourn” over it and “not to associate with immoral people.” Importantly, he also makes clear in vv. 9-13 that these comments only apply to those “who bears the name of brother.” He explicitly writes, “not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world…for what have I to do with judging outsiders?” This is key in informing our response to those who are not members of the church. If it is our desire to see sinners come through our doors and come to know our Savior through our ministry, then we must be welcoming, accepting them where they are. This is not to say we hide or compromise the biblical position, but it is not an issue on which we want to filter people at the door. There are three categories of people in sexual sin that we need to form a response for. First, those just coming to the church who have not committed to it – these should be treated the same as any we are reaching out to with Christ’s love. They need Jesus, not behavioral change. Next, those who have recently joined the church but have pre-existing sexual sin patterns. This can and should be addressed with patience, dignity, and love. There are often many sin areas in the life of a new believer, and it is prudent to discern how and when to address each of them. Lastly, those who have been members in the church for some amount of time and fall into sexual sin. This is the group that Paul is primarily addressing in 1 Corinthians. While sex within marriage is a private issue, sexual sin cannot be a taboo topic. It needs to be addressed regularly and clearly. We need close enough relationships within the church that such problems do not fester in the dark. We must avoid the typical church pattern to vilify the first group, never see the second group, and pretend the third group doesn’t exist until it all blows up in scandal. May it never be.
3: Consistency Issue
There is a tendency in our Christian culture to treat some sexual sins as worse than others. Like the Corinthians, some things we seem to have accepted as just ubiquitous parts of our culture. Knowing the prevalence of promiscuity and fornication among teens and single adults and usage of pornography even within the church, we tend to address these as issues of indwelling sin, similar to anger or fear of man, with offers of accountability and understanding when someone falls. By contrast, when it comes to homosexuality or adultery, it is often a church discipline issue. We view homosexual marriage as a major problem, but remarriage after a non-biblical divorce is rarely addressed. These inconsistencies lead to stigmatization and polarization and should have no place in the church. The criterion for escalation should be unrepentance, not the nature of the sexual sin. It is clear from 1 Corinthians that all should be taken seriously, but none should be vilified above others.
4: Culture and Identity
The major underlying problem with many of the sexual sin and gender issues is that they have come to be culturally bound up with people’s identities. This is not a new phenomenon and is not unique to this issue. As far back as Acts 19, you see people becoming “enraged” because Paul had threatened the Ephesians’ cultural identity as worshipers of Artemis. People continue to find their primary identities in their employment, hobbies, sports teams, or families rather than Christ. None of these should be accepted, but none should be reviled either. If a person does not know Jesus, they are dead. How they identify themselves is of no concern. Once they have been made alive, they can be taught that “whose” they are is more important than “who” they are. All identity outside of Christ is not sinful, but if it takes paramount importance, it may become so. A person who recognizes a tendency toward same sex attraction may label themselves as gay or lesbian. This should not be considered a sin issue unless it becomes, for them, their defining characteristic or leads to sinful actions. We should recognize the difficulty of this struggle and support such a person rather than get hung up on labels. There must be clear distinction between identifying same sex attraction and engaging in homosexual behavior. These should be the guiding principles underlying everything that follows are regards individual cases.
5: Public Facing Information, Guests, and New Attendees
Considering what we have discussed, and Paul’s assertion in 1 Corinthians 5 that we ought to reserve judgment on sexual immorality to those we call brother, I would submit that public facing information regarding the church (i.e. website, app, etc) should not publish a position on sexual immorality, marriage, and gender identity. Doing so effectively places the filter at the door so that people who do not know Christ may be turned away from it. This is not tantamount to tacit approval. In appropriate contexts within the church, these topics should still be discussed and addressed, but I do not believe it is consistent with a biblical treatment of unbelievers to place it in a public facing forum. If we have guests or new regular attendees who appear to be engaged in a cohabitating or fornicating relationship, a homosexual relationship, or other sexual sin, this should not be a priority to address unless we have discerned that they are believers and join the church. Even then, it is important to draw a distinction between someone who deals with same-sex attraction and someone who engages in homosexual behavior. The next seven points are meant to discuss, in broad terms, how we should address those who join the church with pre-existing relationships or identity issues:
6: Promiscuity, Cohabitation – Hebrews 13:4, 1 Cor 7:1-2, Ex 22:16
Much of the biblical discussion on promiscuity is by inference. Clearly, sex was meant to be inseparably linked to marriage and outside of that context should be considered immoral. For those who join the church already in a sexual relationship who are unmarried we should apply Exodus 22:16 and encourage them to marry as soon as possible. If they do not wish to marry, they should be encouraged to separate. Paul acknowledges in 1 Cor 7:2 that marriage is the best remedy for “temptation to sexual immorality.”
7: Adultery, Divorce and Remarriage – Matt 5:32, Matt 19:9, 1 Cor 7:10-11
This issue is given much more explicit biblical instruction but is often glossed over in our Christian culture due to the messy landscape of divorces and remarriages. In cases where non-biblical divorce has occurred, if reconciliation is possible, this should be pursued. If reconciliation is impossible because one or more parties have remarried, it would not be sensible to divorce again in order to achieve reconciliation. The principle to apply here, I believe, is from 1 Cor 7:17-24 summarized in verse 20: “Each one should remain in the condition in which he was called.” This is not an ideal circumstance, but it is the best way forward in an imperfect world. Of note, polygamy was common in the culture of the early church, and while not ideal, was accepted by the church, as evidenced by the qualifications for elder to be “a husband of but one wife.” We have polygamous cultures even within our local community and if they came to Christ, we should not counsel them to divorce all but one wife and thus disrupt their social structure. It is not ideal and would disqualify them from eldership, but they should remain as they are. Whether marriage after unbiblical divorce in the past disqualifies a man from eldership is a case-by case question for the eldership.
8: Pornography, Sensuality, and Lust – Lev 18:6-18, Matt 5:28
As mentioned above, use of pornography has reached a high saturation point within our culture and within our church. While once thought of as simply a male issue, there is a growing trend toward gender parity in pornography usage. It is an issue that should be discussed with some frequency within our church. For those that join the church and view pornography regularly, it needs to be made clear that while the world has largely destigmatized it, it is still sexual immorality. Furthermore, this isn’t just limited to nudity and pornography, but any sensuality that leads to looking at someone “with lustful intent” is the heart equivalent of adultery according to Matt 5:28. In our culture, it is not possible to avoid such things by just turning away. We need to address the heart issues of idolatry, selfishness, and satisfaction in Christ. Practically, how should we deal with those who have on-going struggles with pornography, sensuality and lust? Should this preclude them from eldership? From deaconship? Taken strictly, this would preclude nearly all men from eldership. These require individual evaluation from the elders, but a guiding principle should be, if the person is repentant and there is evidence of growth in their life, we should consider more responsibility and continued discipleship.
9: Homosexuality – Lev 18:22, Lev 20:13, 1 Cor 6:9, 1 Tim 1:8-11
From the above references and others, it is evident that homosexual behavior is sexual sin. We cannot equivocate on that point. As we have discussed above, if a person who is already a believer and in the church and struggles with same sex attraction, we should approach them as we would handle anyone who is sexually attracted to someone to whom they are not married. If such a person decides that homosexuality is not sinful and begins sexually immoral activity, we should deal with them in the same way as any member who falls into unrepentant sin and go through the processes of correction and, if necessary, of church discipline. It is important that we draw a distinction between same sex attraction and homosexual behavior. We can do tremendous harm by demonizing same sex attraction and creating a taboo around it. A person who is struggling to abstain from homosexual behavior should be supported and encouraged. I believe Paul’s strong statements about not associating with sexually immoral people applies to those who remain unrepentant. Much more nuanced is the issue of how we address those that join the church already in a homosexual relationship. What about the married homosexual couple who join the church with their adopted child? Should we break up their family? I believe, in this case, the same principle should apply as to those who have gone through an unbiblical divorce in the past. We should apply 1 Cor 7:20: “Each one should remain in the condition in which he was called.” We can recognize that this is not ideal, but it is the best we can do in a fallen world just as we do with someone who is married after unbiblical divorce. Whether should apply to a homosexual couple in a long term committed relationship who are not legally married would be an individual discussion with the elders. Again, these are nuanced cases that will need individual prayer, discussion, and discernment. I believe a great deal more patience is called for when a new believer joins the church that has a history or present reality of homosexuality, even if they are unrepentant at first, believing that homosexuality is not sinful, than we would demonstrate to a person who has been in the church for a period of time and then decides to pursue a homosexual relationship.
10: Bisexuality – Heb 13:4
Bisexual attraction is no more or less of an issue than anyone who finds that they are sexually attracted to someone other than their spouse. This is not a rare or unique circumstance, even within the church. Someone who is practicing bisexuality is, by definition, not confining sex to the marriage bed, and this, therefore, qualifies as sexual immorality. The issue, here again, is one of identity and cultural acceptance. If a person “identifies as bisexual,” the real issue is not the bisexuality, but the fact that they identify themselves primarily by their sexual desires, and not by Christ. It would be equally a problem if they “identified as heterosexual” and that was seen as their defining characteristic. If such a person were to join the church, our priority should be in helping them see their identity in Christ rather than focusing on renouncing their sexual preference.
11: Transgenderism/Non-binarism – Psalm 139: 13-15
It should be noted that the next two points should not be considered in the category of sexual immorality, but as they are connected to the same cultural moment will be discussed here. It should further be remarked that transgenderism is a modern issue with no direct reference in Scripture. It is a challenging issue that often falls prey to oversimplification and scapegoating. It is not sufficient to simply state that a person should identify with their born gender. There are those born with ambiguous genitalia and those born with sex chromosome abnormalities such that “born gender” is not necessarily accurate. These occur with a frequency of 1 in 448 births on average which is not particularly rare. The majority of people who consider themselves to be transgender do not fall into these categories, but the fact remains that these categories exist. Unless we plan to embark on genetic testing, we must be careful how we assert someone’s gender assignment. Furthermore, we must acknowledge that much of the gender confusion in our culture is due to a distortion of biblically accurate masculinity and femininity in our culture of which the church has been widely supportive for generations. Many transgender and non-binary individuals consider themselves so because they do not fit into the traditional boxes our culture has created for the genders. The church can start by recognizing that these boxes are incorrect. We can also acknowledge that gender differences and roles are far less important than most human cultures perceive. Christ himself challenged many gender norms in his ministry and Paul maintains “…there is no male or female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.” (Gal 3:28b) It is much more difficult to recognize this issue as a sin issue than many of the above concerns. If someone wishes to be addressed by different pronouns than they once did or dress differently than they once did, this does not amount to immorality. Once again, this can be an idolatrous identity issue if the person sees it as the central characteristic of their lives. There is often an inherent pride in asserting that such a person does not feel they fit in the body created for them, but if they come to love Jesus and understand and believe that they are “fearfully and wonderfully made” then this issue may become moot. Whether or not they revert to dressing differently or using pronouns they did when they were younger is largely immaterial. This also addresses the issue of people who may have undergone permanent physical changes. While we should not endorse such modification if it is being considered, there is no reason to reverse such a thing in order to return to a base state. We must recognize that this is a group that has a high propensity toward mental health concerns, instability, and suicidality. They need love, support and prayer, not scapegoating and extra-biblical expectations of conforming to a cultural norm. We must further note that this group as well as the homosexual group have often experienced psychological and even physical harm from others in our culture, sometimes in the name of Christ. We must foster an environment of champions physical and psychological safety for these people.
12: Asexuality – 1 Cor 7:25-38
Asexuality also should not be considered sexual immorality. There is, in fact, wide support in Paul’s letters such as in 1 Cor 7 for people, if they are able, to remain unmarried and be “anxious about the things of the Lord, how to please the Lord.” We tend to champion the model of the nuclear family in our Christian culture, but Paul sees chaste singleness as a better way. There should be no pressure from the church to make sure that single people pair off and get married because it is expected of them. As this state has been culturally identified with the LGBTQIA movement, it is seen on the same spectrum as the sexual immorality and gender issues discussed above, but it is not. It can still fall prey to the same issue of an idolatrous identity as some of the above issues, but it need not be so.
13: Glass Ceiling
In the event that God sees fit to bring people from these subgroups into our church, there would inevitably be a glass ceiling. The question is at what point. The four logical points are: regular attender, member, deacon, and elder. Regardless of their background or position, all should be welcome to be a regular attender. It is also clear, from the biblical requirements for eldership, that on-going problems or engagement in any of the sexual sins would disqualify them from that post. The middle two are less clear. I would submit that the bar for membership should be very low. This step, in my opinion, is when they would “bear the name of brother” and not before. Even if they disagree about the sinful nature of homosexuality, this should not disallow them from becoming members as long as they agree to submit to the churches position and not cause division. Allowing them to become members gives us the pastoral authority to speak into their lives, and we would hope that over time the Spirit would work in their hearts to convince them of the truth. Putting such a person in a deacon role would probably not be wise but would need to be evaluated prayerfully on a case-by-case basis. The difficulty here is that, while a position on homosexuality is not a salvific issue and should not be considered a core doctrine in the same way as the deity of Christ, for example, it is a sin issue. There is a limit to how far we can “agree to disagree” and still uphold our duty to root out sin in our midst. Once again, we should also distinguish between a struggle with same sex attraction and engagement in homosexual behavior when we consider our response. There is also a glass ceiling when it comes to marriage. While I believe we should not break up existing homosexual marriages, we should not participate in creating them. The marriage covenant between a man and woman was created, in part, to reflect the relationship between Christ and the church (Eph 5). This should not be co-opted to excuse or normalize immorality.
14: Nuance and Edge Cases
The above outline is by no means meant to be exhaustive or definitive. It is meant to provide a lens, supported by scripture, through which we can view these issues and consider corporate and pastoral responses. It should inform how we view the people that walk through the door from a wide range of backgrounds and how we equip those in our church to be Christ’s ambassadors to those in our community. Every person and circumstance, history and baggage will be different, and any non-nuanced position would be inherently evil. I pray we have many opportunities to talk, think and pray through specific situations that God would bless us with the chance to be a part of. What an honor it would be to be used to reach into broken lives like these with the Gospel of Grace.
15: Action Steps
As we consider practical and philosophical ways of responding to the above, I believe we should start from a position of corporate repentance. If we wish to truly reach out and touch the lives of broken people in need of a Savior who live a life of same sex attraction or gender dysphoria, we need to begin by recognizing that a great deal of harm, emotional and physical, has been inflicted on this group by the Church for generations. There are homeless people living in our area who were kicked out of their homes by parents holding a Bible. There are those who have been subjected to horrific methods that amount to torture under the guise of “Conversion Therapy” from Christian organizations. The only “conversion” we should concern ourselves with is to a regenerate heart. Attempting to change someone’s sexual attraction is very much beside the point. We cannot hope to be a place where such people can hear about Jesus unless they feel safe to enter our doors. We must also fight the tendency to consider sin in this area as something worse than others, even in non-Christians. James 2 says “…For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it….So speak and so act as those who are to be judged under the law of liberty. For judgment is without mercy to one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.” As we consider corporate and pastoral responses to the argument above, we must start by removing our own planks and repenting for the historical actions of the Church.
Practical steps that we could consider taking would include: removing the statements from the website about marriage and sexuality, especially directly under our Core Beliefs. Again, this is not meant to hide or equivocate on the truth, but not to set such a barrier before someone even walks through our door. Secondly, we should consider how to address these topics within the church. A Sunday morning sermon is not ideal as it is time limited and a unidirectional conversation. A small group course format would be a consideration. We need to equip parents and family members of adolescents, teens, and adults with language to talk about these things in loving, humble, God-honoring ways. In the longer term, we need to consider how we can make our church a place where people would feel comfortable inviting friends and family who look, think and act differently than we do. We need to find a way of projecting safety and inclusion even in our public facing information. This isn’t a balancing act where we must make it clear early and often that we “love the sinner but hate the sin” as the saying goes. We just need to love the sinner. Dealing with the sin can come later God-willing. A third application point is to be mindful of what we say and what we allow to be said without being checked. Certainly, joking at the expense of those who are dealing with these issues is unacceptable, but we also need to work to avoid getting dragged in to pseudo-political discussions on bathroom issues, sports issues or other divisive concerns that have no bearing on the church.
I recognize that these proposals have the potential to divide the church. There are some who may leave the body over these sorts of changes. I would argue that it is our responsibility to them as well as to the unreached in our community to have those discussions and risk some of them leaving over it. These are not all things we should change overnight but after ample opportunities for discussions and prayer.
16: Conclusion – Mark 2:15-17
At its core, these are not issues of who someone loves, sexual attraction, or even specific sex acts. The core is idolatry and identity. When acceptance by others, self-determination, or physical pleasure become the central force driving our lives then we have become idolators. Though our idols take on different shapes, the struggles in this space are shared by all. Whether you are identified by your profession, your family, or your gender identity, you are not being identified by your Master. Building fences around or within the church because someone sins in a different way than us cannot be allowed. Making the excuse that we are somehow “protecting our children” by shielding them from people in our community who desperately need a Savior will not show our children who Jesus is. Within the church, we cannot be afraid to “speak the truth in love.” We need not and cannot shy away from sin in the church, but we must recognize that the Spirit works in each of our lives. Often this happens over a period of time. We should be prepared to walk alongside our brothers and sisters in this journey for as long as they need.
There is a significant correlation between this community and their relationship with religious groups, and the “tax collectors and sinners” that Jesus sought out in His ministry and their relationship with the religious leaders of the day. Our heart should reflect His. Jesus responded: “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.” (Mark 2:17) If our church was filled with transgender people and gay families that loved Jesus, God would be glorified.”
Thank you in advance for any constructive criticism, notes of encouragement and or reading recommendations on these topics that I can pass along.

Let me open with the context that yes, this is a post dealing with Beni Anusim and the "messianic Jews", and yes I'm aware that a lot of it is identitarian hype. I'm not jewish. And is only a possibility that "zero Yisreal" applies to anyone in my family. A possibility. I feel obliged to research that possibility but don't know how.
A little personal history for context: I have a strong respect for Judaism and for Israel, most of what I know of both comes from practicing Jews and an Israeli Rabbi. I was raised in what most people would describe as a 'middle class white evangelical home'. There was a fair amount of fraud to this. Because a lot of what my parents said and did had more to do with their behavioral health than religion or faith, and it appears the same is true of their parents. But that's neither here nor there. What is pertinent is that my father has had a life long academic interest in judaism in regards to the origins of christianity. In my early teens this developed into an obsession. I was briefly exposed to the 'messianic movement', and don't have much respect for most of them as everything I've seen and heard from them is its largely gentiles playing Hebrew-dress-up to try and legitimize making up a new religion that's neither jewish nor christian. Fast forward a few years and we were involved with the local synagog, chabad house and CJCUC.
Now, my father passed on a very strong oral tradition of our patrilineal genealogy. And at no point in the first 20-23 years of my life was there the slightest indication of there being anything 'jewish' in any of it anywhere. Then he started changing it and saying that the ancestor who'd come to America spoke yiddish. I chalk that up to wishful thinking. Even so, I was strongly considering conversion to judaism at this point. To date, there is still a part of me that strongly desires to do this. But cannot, in full sincerity, do so. Ironically, it was after backing off of this and marrying my wife that I stumbled onto some facts of history and our family that have made me question the possibility of my patrilineal being 'Zara Yisreal'. Without a paper trail, it's circumstantial at best. I would like to find a paper trail to confirm or deny this line of questioning. But don't know where to look.
Thats where the problem lies. The city in Poland no longer has records thanks to their wonderful neighbors. And while websites like 'ancestry.com' or 'the poznanproject' are supposed to have any surviving documents, there are no birth, death, or marriage certificates that even remotely match the family members who came over from Poland. As far as paper trails, it's like they just materialized on a boat from Poland in 1891. I don't know who they were. And yes, I know it's a bit obsessive of me to chase after this. I'm working on it with my counselor, thanks. In the meantime, I want to research this and would like to know how one would go about proving or disproving whether these people might have been Beni Animus. I know the Lutherans under Prussia had a habit of 'bribing' Jews in their empire into converting and that rich German protestants would literally 'adopt' whole families of converso's, changing their surnames etc. And there was a pogrom in 1890. But again, it's all circumstantial. And without having a way to establish facts, it's a maddening fractal dead end.
This, and my own mixed feelings coming out of my parents 'not quite ger tovit' makes me want to be able to talk to jews and the Rabi's at my local synagogue. And I just genuinely miss that connection. jews are special people. But I have no clue how to even approach them, let alone start the conversations I want to have. Every forum and conversation I have found is either bitter ex-christians who are converting to Judaism for, at best, mixed reasons, or the messianics. I don't fit into either category. But no one seems to be open to dialogue.
To summarize using a metaphor, I inherited a chest of restless spirits. I hope finding a paper trail will let me lay one to rest. so far I've only found dead ends. If you could help me bridge that gap, it would be much appreciated. If it is possible to exorcise more than just the one ghost, cool.

The familiar sounds of the office fill the ears of the "Adventurer" as he steps into his home away from home. To him "Familiar sounds" means the voices of about three-quarters of the hundreds of employees who work in this building, thanks to the progressive, passive, perpetual boosts to his senses that he has simply always been accruing. He still can't quite hear everything in the office, indeed as powerful as his senses are he can only actively sense enough space around him to be firmly aware of events occurring about half of the building's length and width away from him at a time, but those are still incredibly powerful senses.
Lucas steps past several cubicles and heads to his own with a calm smile on his face. He actually enjoys his job, not because he finds the work fulfilling but because it presents him with a chance to level up his skills and work towards becoming altogether stronger in a hilariously safe environment. The figure sits in his cubicle and logs into his work computer with a bright grin on his face. As he grabs the last pieces of paper in the backlog that was a big problem when he began to work for this company he feels a pang of pride.
The workday is pleasant enough. He successfully finishes the last pile of paperwork that was considered part of the backlog and this effort is celebrated by his direct supervisor and a few of the friends he's made in his department, a group composed of several men and only a few pair of women, who have been working here for years but lacked the abilities he possesses that allow him to grind out progress at a rapid rate and allow him to improve the work he does every single day without fail. The news quickly spreads throughout the office, and various people, including other departmental supervisors and managers, come to him and congratulate him.
When the day ends Lucas is one of the first people out the door. This is commonly expected Lucas-like behavior at this point so no one bats an eye at it. The figure works and then leaves, and he seems to have an incredibly strict policy about work-life balance to the point that no one from the office has seen his apartment or even seen him outside of the office aside from on social media.
The lad walks towards a nearby mall even as he checks his phone. When the decently cautious man is sure he's not being watched he uses his inventory to swap outfits, changing into something much more casual than his work uniform so he can do his equivalent of trolling. His clothes go from being the professional outfit someone might expect to see an accountant in, to the much more casual clothes of someone who works at a Game Station the local equivalent of a Game Stop.
The minute the figure reaches the mall he relaxes and steps into it with a smile on his face as he is suddenly and powerfully aware of events going on all around him now that the sounds he's been passively hearing for the last few minutes are not muffled by layers of solid American construction. The mall is a favorite haunt of his, a place where there are enough people that even if something goes awry he can pretty easily escape in the chaos and commotion that any sort of hostile actions would necessarily cause. Still, to the figure's credit he has not been caught yet.
The thief begins his training by carefully studying the department store he's in. He can be a bit bolder now than he could weeks ago, as in the time since he began to hone this skill he's enhanced it in such a way that he can teleport objects directly into his inventory, which is a tremendous improvement even if he can't take anything bigger or heavier than a cleaver. He eventually spots a teenager with a wallet that is just visible out of the corner of his pockets. Lucas diligently uses "Observe" on him and the powerful skill is strong enough now that Lucas can use it to determine someone's affiliations. When the young adult spots that the teen belongs to a gang he decides it's worth taking his potentially ill-gotten gains.
The clever trickster points a single finger in the direction of the teen's pocket and silently casts the handy spell. A thin line of energy lances out of his extended digit and sails through the air toward the teenager. When the teen begins to move Lucas hisses in annoyance and expends a bit more magical energy to take advantage of the first skill he's gained as a result of an attribute hitting 50: arcane manipulation.
Days ago the young adventurer's passion for magic and healing resulted in two classes leveling up on the same day: mage and white mage. This resulted in his intelligence going from 49 to 52, and as a result of that he gained the ability to manipulate magical energy, so long as he can detect the magic in question and is willing to spend some magic of his own. In this world, where the figure is reasonably certain that no other magical beings exist, this means that to hone this skill the wizard needs to manipulate his own magic. Still, that hasn't stopped the young professional from tirelessly doing just that.
With a significant amount of focus the mage is able to manipulate the thin beam and twists and turns it so that it circles around the teen before snaking into his pocket and striking the young gangster's wallet. When Lucas feels the wallet enter his inventory he chuckles and makes his way out of the department store. The rest of this particular bout of training is filled with similar feats of arcane finesse and hilariously minor acts that will steal from those willing to enact violence on others in exchange for money. Lucas's clever usage of his skills coupled with his willingness to act in stunningly petty and annoying ways make him great at harassing those he designates his foes. Lucas, lacking an ability to kill those he fights thanks to a drawback affecting him, has thus far refused to actually engage those he has marked as his foes in direct battle but his desire to annoy them has led to willingly target people associated with criminal groups with some of his spatial magic.
In hours the figure is back home and he is toying with the newest toy he's received from his gacha system. A guitar sits on his lap and he fiddles with the instrument, even he listens to a video about how to tune the thing. Lucas is experimenting with something, and behind the tablet he gained some time ago is a book that contains information on tuning guitars. The tablet is in use, recording what the man is up to. An app is in use and it records the sounds the guitar chords make. The self-taught musician relies on some of his new skills for this, as he has only recently gained the "Guitar" and "Guitar Maintenance" skills, and he got them at different times so they are different levels. Nonetheless, the figure patiently records himself, occasionally stopping the recording and examining it. He is diligently using his long-term planning skills and sticking to his broad plan. At the same time the figure patiently uses magic and steadily hones the "Mage" class, using his magic skills to farm multiple sources of experience while adhering to the schedule he has informally given himself.
Eventually the next day rolls around and the figure, predictably, gets out of his apartment and goes to work. If you had explained the concept of "Jumping" to Lucas a year ago and asked him if he thought so much of it would be just working a 9-5 job he'd not have believed you and yet in the context of his experience with the unusual profession a stunning amount of time has just been him being a regular employee of a perfectly mundane business.
Time continues to pass for the would-be adventurer at a steady pace. In this mundane world a figure with legitimate supernatural abilities is a uniquely powerful presence, and this is especially true of one that is determined to keep his head down and nose clean. Lucas's determination to live a regular, relatively risk-free life does not stop him from living, but it does stop him from suffering from some sort of "Middle School Second Year Syndrome" as a result of the fact that he has gained trainable superpowers. Instead of going mad with power or gaining an unhealthy mentality Lucas has just enough knowledge of how jumping works to know that while he might be a big fish in this world he is not a big fish in other worlds like Fallout, The Elder Scrolls, or even something as aggressively hostile and oppressive as the general setting of Minecraft is.
If an objective, impartial onlooker viewing Lucas's life is given the chance to describe the sort of "Television Show" that they are watching, they'd say it could easily be considered slice-of-life. For the first few months of his time here the most exciting times are the rare moments he adds something new to his slowly expanding list of activities and the even more slowly growing list of things he can do, such as when he begins to walk the streets of the city he lives in at night and cast healing, positive, restorative magic on the sleeping homeless people he encounters. This activity ultimately earns him the peculiar title of "Unsung Saint", a title which enhances the effectiveness of his restorative or otherwise beneficial magic on those not aware of the fact that he is using magic on them.
Days of work, training, and controlled, planned forays into new pastimes, turn into weeks of steady and anticipated progress. Weeks of steady and anticipated progress turn into months of upward mobility and the healthy establishments of new baseline feats. That said, eventually progress slows and becomes more difficult for the jumper in a world as relatively safe, for supernatural beings, as this one. It doesn't take terribly long for Lucas to go from a somewhat predictable, fairly focused figure who is very specialized in a number of areas, to a somewhat more well-rounded figure with a steadily increasing repository of skills and abilities, thanks to a subtle shift in growth strategies.
​Just a few days short of eleven months into his stay in this jump, the jumper is facing a new foe but is participating in an activity he's come to enjoy; sparring.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
I dodge a well-aimed right-handed punch intended for my face, though thanks to my agility I easily had enough time to dodge it, It took a long time, from my viewpoint, for it to get close to me so long enough that I only let it get this close on purpose. I'm holding back in terms of my speed and strength but my opponent, a friend I made at the gym a few weeks ago, doesn't need to know that. I have way too many supernatural advantages for it to be a fair fight if I don't hold back.
I give my opponent enough time to register that I've dodged the blow before I begin to telegraph, purposefully, my next attack. I purposefully overextend my left arm and launch a powerful, but slow, strike. The man grits his teeth and moves to intercept my strike. He is fast enough to position his arm in front of it but that is still a mistake. I guide my blow into his arm and watch as he lets out a sincere, pained, grunt. Even with me holding back I still allow DPS to work its magic, and that perk coupled with both my trained and perk-enhanced strength is enough for me to deal him a decently powerful blow.
I retract my fist with a sly smile and note that the bars that cover my field of view are all going up at different rates. The bar for "Brawler", a class that's the result of "Fighter" giving me access to a new class when it hit level 10, my currently equipped class, is going up at a healthy clip as I spar with this man, as is the bar for "Precision Strikes" and "Acting", some of my skills. Most of the things going up at a decent clip are affected by "Jack of All Trades" a perk thatreduces the time and effort it takes for me to train up new skills to around the level of my average. Most of my other bars are only slightly going up, but this is acceptable. This sort of training is vital, long term, for my very survival, and thanks to my perks is pretty easy for me to do.
Behind me I hear a familiar voice cheering; Hannah's. The lovely redhead has begun to accompany me to the gym, but this is a somewhat recent development. Before a few weeks ago we only occasionally saw each other on Saturdays at the cafe she worked at, though we have been texting buddies ever since we met. Marcus, my sparring partner, grins savagely at me as he listens to my friend and gym buddy's cheers.
"I can't let you show me up in front of your girl, Lucas. We're not close like that." Marcus tells me, though the words are insincere. Marcus is a friend of mine, one who has even tasted my food, and that's something I don't let others do as much as I once did, barring people who go to the soup kitchen when I'm one of the volunteers on duty. My cooking can now do some decent stuff so I don't want to get anyone who isn't an ally or someone I need in my pocket overly reliant on my skills. I grin at the muscular bruiser of a warrior and dart back before gesturing for him to come at me like he means it. The man lets out a hearty laugh as he begins to pursue me. He is a touch taller than me and he has muscular, wide arms that take up a lot of space.
I watch, diligently, as he swings them at me when he is in the martial sweet spot of being close enough to hit me with a fully extended fist and being far enough away for me to strike back in an effort to preempt or counter his blow. I dart forward even as he stops advancing and duck underneath the strike before I use an active skill from my "Dancer" class to infuse my agility into my strength and hit him with a blow that disorients him. He steps back, a look of pain and confusion on his face as I step forward and move close enough to hit the man with a much softer blow to the chest. I feel his solid muscles block part of the harm done to him, but the blow is still solid enough that I watch his HP lower.
He gasps in pain and staggers back, and I smile at him and sense my triumph. He's only lost a small portion of his total hit points, but for normal people, one's total stock of HP is an abstraction of their physical health. For me, my HP serves as a skillful shield that protects me at all times, and for me to fall in battle someone has to whittle away my entire bar before they take me out. In fact, right now my HP is not maxed out; earlier I took a hit from Marcus that I'm still recovering from.
I take a step forward before Marcus signals that he needs a break. I laugh, the sound filling the part of the gym we're fighting in, and stop approaching the man. Hannah walks up to the ring and offers me some of her water as I walk toward one of the corners of the small ring. I silently gesture that I'll accept it and she tosses it at me. When the object is in my hand I use subtle telekinesis to mess with my boxing glove just enough to more easily hold onto the water bottle and sip from it. The cool water tastes good, and I smile as I feel it helping me relax as I wait to continue the fight. This is the sixth time I've beaten Marcus, but I'll give the man one bit of praise: he's persistent. He likes fighting enough that he is always eager to try and fight me, and I like fighting just enough to appreciate his resistance to the idea that I can beat him. It's not always easy for me to keep on finding partners that I can spar with.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
In the days that follow this fight, the young jumper continues to spar with Marcus. He steadily trains his "Brawler" class, and takes on class skills that do things like make him a more efficient hand-to-hand fighter, even gaining skills that he suspects, and hopes that he won't need here; like the ability to launch a punch that can inflict damage at a distance.
The figure's volunteering remains a steadfast facet of his in-jump identity. The man gains popularity throughout the place that is, functionally, his hometown, as he becomes a well-known volunteer. He even makes the places he volunteers at more popular, using a steadily increasing amount of local and online popularity to advocate for the organizations he supports. This first began to occur about three months into his stay in the jump, but he really begins to leverage it at the six month mark and he quickly begins to slowly become a minor force in the community, taking advantage of his heavy charisma build to sway hearts and minds to his cause.
His days at work continue to remain fairly unchanged from how they were at the start of his time in the jump, though on very rare occasions he creates reports and the in-jump equivalent of PowerPoint presentations about the data he has compiled to his supervisor. He has also overseen a day of service for members of his department to go and volunteer at the soup kitchen where he volunteered on the day he met Hannah, allowing him a pleasant chance to practice his leadership skills. He earns his first pay raise just under a year into his stay in this setting.
Minor missteps occur along the way, such as the figure overbooking himself during one particularly hectic weekend, which annoys his friends and fellow volunteers but serves as a decently humbling experience for the overly eager adventurer and also shows his friends that he is, ultimately, human.
Lucas continues his relaxed, fairly peaceful days for more and more time. By the time he has been in the jump for a full two years his pre-jump life feels like a memory or a strange dream, though this change to his state of mind does not actually mean he cannot recall such a time only that he has fully acclimated to the realities of being a jumper. At least as much as someone who is still on their first jump can acclimate to such a thing.
A/N: I like this episodic style for the necessary time skips that a standard (or mostly standard) jumpchain story will require. Now I'm gonna say that this style won't be universal across all jumps since some jumps may be better suited to shorter timeframes. Heck some more story-intensive jumps may benefit from longer focuses on individual events and sequences of events, but we've gone past the tutorial phase for this jump and I think minor episodic looks at broad timescales is better than a thousand chapter story that only hits one year in a jump and ultimately gets dropped. That said, I know that I'm not doing this style of writing PERFECTLY, so I hope that I can use this to grow as a writer and to become better able to convey how long time skips affect the characters, relationships, and strengths of the people involved over time. Still, if nothing else this was fun.
ALSO, as an author's note that is unique to the subreddit: this story is being published on Spacebattles and the white line that cuts through parts of the story indicates a narration/viewpoint shift. On Spacebattles and several other places I write there are in-built formatting options that allow you to cut through a textbox with a horizontal line which serves as a visual marker for some significant change to some aspect of the story. The line I made was my attempt to do that here on Reddit. It's... not perfect, but hey I'm trying.

Hey guys, I've come here to ask for some guidance. I've been in the field of "telling facts and showing stuff to people" since I started college. I was tutoring in college since 17 as a side gig and naturally moved into a more child- centered part of education since graduation. But I'm now 27 and I feel like it's time for me to go.
I around $45-50K and I'm trying to find somebly that could carry me to at least $75K. I'm not trying to live a baller life style. I drive a fully paid used car and only have 2 subscription that I share with my family. I'm not in a bad place but I can't afford to treat myself to something. I had to let go of a sizeable majority of my savings due a cluster of fuckery hitting me all at once in the past 2 years and now I gotta start from near scratch. I gotta do something different
I have decent soft and hard skills:

• I'm good w/ people and educating. I'm always put in charge of training and the on-boarding for new employees. I'm their point of reference
• I have a (allegedly) good sense of humor and get along with all my colleagues. I'm not shy in front of a crowd. The church I used to attend as a teen encouraged Youth involvement and I was (unfortunately) very often picked lmao
• I'm good w/ math and math concepts. I also know the basics of computer programing and have some beginner projects under my belt
• I have been pursuing a more statistics focused math certification and will fGwish w/ it next year

I know that I would like to work on technology while getting to interact w/ people. I would like to contribute to some meaningful and helpful climate tech and working with like-minded peers is awesome. I wouldn't mind doing some trainings if need be to get to that. I'm used to getting my hands and outfit dirty under a car or a garden, so I don't mind a jo that has some ooutdoorsy aspect to it
I understand that the job market is currently, at best, weird. I do enjoy training people, it's a thing that I genuinely like. But this year has been a year of self-reflection and I had to admit to myself that the other reason why I'm still there is due to inertia. The job was relatively easy to get in before COVID, was not furloughed during COVID and seems A.I proof (for now). But I feel like I have reached a soft ceiling. The amount of work I have to output in to reach certain salaries is excessive compared to other professionals. To top it off, I feel kinda done with the field as it is. I'm not "jaded" or anything, but it's more of a "I just wanna do something else and my heart isn't in it anymore". I tried for the past 6 months to grind and put in the work and it was a limp dick effort because I feel checked out. I talked to some of my supervisors and the day-today ahead doesn't seem that stimulating to me. I feel like there's nothing more for me to learn. I've done this for 10 years and I want out
Maybe I'm expecting too much of a job. But if I'm going to spend 7-8hrs/day doing something, I want to be meaningful. That's why I choose this.
What are some good concrete first steps that I can take to make this happen? Are there any certifications, specific job boards or forums to visit? Do I have to go back to school ffs? I'm in the US Northeast

I made an account yesterday so that I could connect with other survivors from the troubled teen industry. I made a couple posts and tried to send a message (unsuccessfully). Turns out I got shadow banned.
I made this account today and was able to respond to posts in that forum but I am still unable to create my own post or send messages. When I try to create a post the "post" button is blacked out in the troubled teen group. When I try to message it tells me that I have done too much. I get that it is an attempt to cut down on spam.
I would appreciate any advice as I'm finally ready to face what I went through but seem to be running into roadblocks trying to use this app.

This week’s vintage batch features black hard rubber pens from three of the Big Four American Makers of the 1910s-20s. Nibs range from Flex to Wet Noodle. As always, all are fully restored and ready to write.
 
ALBUM & TIMESTAMP
 
Pastable link: https://imgur.com/a/R5fpCKe
 
Condition (n.b.): All pens listed below have been disassembled, cleaned and restored with new sacs installed in the last couple weeks. Each of these pens is guaranteed to fill and write as designed without leaks or other problems. Nibs have been adjusted when necessary to ensure that all lay down a smooth and consistent line.
THESE PENS HAVE NO CRACKS, CHIPS, PERSONALIZATIONS, LOOSE OR MISSING PARTS, BENT NIBS, MISALIGNED TINES, BROKEN/WORN OFF TIPPING, OR THREADING ISSUES.
 
Line Widths and Writing Samples: To provide buyers with as much information as possible, I have started to adopt the following line width standards: XXF (.1-.2mm); XF (approx .3mm); F (approx .4mm); M (approx .6mm); B (approx .8mm). Nib flexibility is determined by variation (max line width under pressure) and softness (amount of pressure). Flexibility designations based on variation generally run as follows for an XF/F nib: Semi-Flex (approx. 1mm); Flex (1.2-1.9mm); Superflex (>2mm). All line width measurements are taken with a digital caliper but should be considered approximations providing a general guide. Width may vary slightly depending on type of ink and paper used as well as amount of pressure applied. All writing samples are on Rhodia dot paper using Waterman Serenity Blue.
 
 
1. 1920s Waterman 92 1/2 (BCHR, GPT, lever filler, 14k XF Flex nib). This slender (1/2-sized) model is longer than a ring top but slightly shorter than a 52, measuring 4 3/4” capped and 6” posted. Not to be confused with the later, celluloid 92, this 92 1/2 is made of black chased hard rubber with gold-plated trim. It’s the first I’ve ever encountered. Cap came clipless from the factory (no holes drilled for a clip), but has been outfitted with a gold-plated accommodation clip. Based on its absence from US catalogues, I believe this model was made strictly for foreign export. The barrel has a Canadian imprint while the nib reads “Ideal / England,” it being a common practice for Waterman’s Canadian pens to be finished in England. That 14k nib is a Flexible writer (note change from writing sample after taking measurement. It lays down a smooth and consistent XF line that widens to a 3B+ (approx 1.8mm) under moderate pressure (see WRITING SAMPLE). Thin hairlines and reliable flow over its full range of flex make it a great choice for shaded writing. Condition: fine [C]. This pen has no functional flaws but does show some use. Hard rubber is an even dark chocolate color – still much darker than the brown these can turn. Chasing is significantly yet evenly weakened across the cap and barrel. Hard rubber surface is smooth with no deep scratches or other notable blemishes. Gold-plating on the lever has a sliver of brassing in the center and parts of the clip look tarnished, though I’m not sure this amounts to full-fledged brassing. Manufacturer imprint on barrel and number stamp on barrel end are weakened but fully legible. An affordable user and a lovely writer for those wondering at what all the fuss is about early Watermans. Price: $150 SOLD
 
2. 1910s Waterman 12 Eyedropper (BCHR, German Silver clip, eyedropper filler, 14k F Superflex nib). This full-sized model measures 5 1/8” capped. This slip-cap eyedropper is made of black chased hard rubber with a rivet clip marked “German Silver” – less common than the standard nickel clips. This pen is an eyedropper. The section unscrews for the barrel to filled using an eyedroppepipette – holds far more ink than a lever filler of the same size. My usual caveats about early eyedroppers apply here. If carried, it is not uncommon to find a little ink on the nib or in the cap. Super-Flexible 14k Ideal NY #2 nib lays down a smooth and consistent F line that widens to a 4B+ (approx 2.5mm) under light pressure (see WRITING SAMPLE). Easy variation and reliably wet flow over its full range of flex make it a great choice for calligraphic writing styles such as Copperplate and Spencerian. Condition: excellent- [B-]. Hard rubber of the cap is dark black with virtually no fading but center of barrel shows fading to dark chocolate under certain lights. Chasing on cap is sharp and deep but barrel chasing is very light and only visible when the light strikes it. German Silver clip is pristine with no brassing or other notable wear. Hard rubber surface is smooth with no deep scratches or other notable blemishes. Manufacturer imprint on barrel is weak but mostly legible while number stamp on barrel-end is all but worn away. Price: $190 SOLD
 
3. c.1918 Waterman 52 (BCHR, NPT w/ Sterling Silver clip, lever filler, 14k XXF Needlepoint Superflex nib). This full-sized model measures 5 5/16” capped. A nice example of Waterman’s celebrated workhorse made of black chased hard rubber with a sterling silver Ideal accommodation clip with “Waterman’s / Made in France” stamped on one side and a hallmark that reads “GP” on the other side (DETAIL PHOTO). This pen came clipless from the factory (no holes drilled for a rivet clip). Super-Flexible 14k Ideal NY #2 nib has a needlepoint width and superb snap-back that gives it a surgically precise feel when writing. It lays down a smooth and consistent XXF line that widens to a 4B+ (approx 2.2mm) under light pressure (see WRITING SAMPLE). Insanely responsive snap-back, needlepoint hairlines, and reliable flow over its full range of flex make it another excellent choice for calligraphic writing styles such as Copperplate and Spencerian. Condition: excellent [B]. Hard rubber retains its dark black color with virtually no fading. Chasing is weakened a bit yet readily visible over the cap and barrel. Hard rubber surface is smooth with no deep scratches or other notable blemishes. Manufacturer imprint on barrel is quite weak and only partly legible while number stamp on barrel-end is deep and fully legible. Price: $260 SOLD
 
4. c.1918 Waterman 52 in Box (BCHR, NPT, lever filler, 14k M/B Superflex Factory Stub nib). This full-sized model measures 5 5/16” capped. This pen comes in its original factory box with 5-page pamphlet including care and filling instructions as well as other offerings from Waterman (BOX PHOTO). It’s a clean 52 made of black chased hard rubber with nickel-plated trim including earlier, wide rivet clip. 14k Ideal #2 nib is a Super-Flexible Factory Stub that manages to deliver sharp unflexed variation without compromising smoothness. Under normal pressure it lays down a smooth and consistent M/B line (approx .7mm) on the down-strokes and XF line on the cross-strokes. And the line widens to a 4B+ (approx 2.0mm) under light pressure (see WRITING SAMPLE – note change in flex grade after measuring). A versatile nib whose responsive snap-back, easy variation, and reliable flow over its full range of flex make it well suited to shaded notes under normal pressure and calligraphic writing styles under flex, the Stub grind keeping one’s letterforms neat and straight. Condition: excellent+ [B+]. This pen and the one below came from an estate of someone who seems to have purchased these pens, wrote with them a few times, then stowed them away in their boxes. This one is definitely collector-grade, having seen very little use. Hard rubber retains its dark black color with no discernible fading. Chasing is evenly sharp and crisp. Hard rubber surface is smooth with no deep scratches or other notable blemishes. Manufacturer imprint on barrel and number stamp on barrel-end are deep and fully legible. Box is in sound condition with no torn ends but original owner managed somehow to burn a couple small holes in the paperwork. A boxed 52 with an uncommon nib in uncommonly clean condition. Price: $310 SOLD
 
5. c.1918 Waterman 55 in Box (BCHR, NPT, lever filler, 14k XF Flex/Superflex nib). This oversized model has a thick girth and measures 5 1/2” capped. This pen comes in its original factory box with 5-page pamphlet including care and filling instructions as well as other offerings from Waterman (BOX PHOTO). This pen is made of black chased hard rubber with nickel-plated trim including earlier, wide rivet clip. Commensurably oversized Ideal NY #5 nib yields Super-Flexible variation with Flexible softness. It lays down a smooth and consistent XF line that widens to a 4B+ (approx 2.1mm) under moderate pressure (see WRITING SAMPLE – note change in flex grade after measuring). Condition: excellent+/near mint [B+]. This pen came from the same estate as the 52 above and also resembles an artifact of a time capsule. Hard rubber retains its factory black color with no discernible fading. Chasing is factory sharp and crisp. Hard rubber surface is smooth with no deep scratches or other notable blemishes. Manufacturer imprint on barrel and number stamp on barrel-end are deep and fully legible. Box is in sound condition with no torn ends but original owner managed somehow to burn some small holes in the paperwork for this one as well. These big fellas are getting tougher to find, especially in this condition. Price: $440 SOLD
 
6. c.1921 Wahl Pen 72 (BCHR, NPT, lever filler, 14k XXF Superflex nib). This standard sized model measures 5 3/16” capped. Having purchased the assets of the Boston Fountain Pen Company, Wahl began manufacturing fountain pens in 1917. Wahl’s first pens were essentially rebranded Bostons and Tempoints (a NY company they acquired in 1918). The first full-fledged Wahls, dubbed simply “The Wahl Pen,” rolled off out of the factory in 1921. This 72 one of those pens. Its’s made of black chased hard rubber complemented by nickel-plated trim including Wahl’s patented roller-clip. The Wahl Pen is chiefly distinguished from earlier designs by its patented Wahl lever with apexed center. Super-Flexible 14k Wahl Pen #2 nib is a lovely writer. It lays down a smooth and consistent XF line that widens to a 4B+ (approx 2.4mm) under light pressure (see WRITING SAMPLE). Needlepoint hairlines, superbly responsive snap-back, and reliable flow over its full range of flex make it another great choice for calligraphic writing styles. Condition: excellent [B+]. Hard rubber retains its factory black color with virtually no fading/oxidation. Chasing is factory deep and crisp with no discernible wear. Surface is smooth and lustrous with no deep scratches or other notable blemishes. Nickel-plated trim is exceptionally clean with no brassing or other noteworthy blemishes apart from light scratching to the clip. Manufacturer imprint on barrel and number stamp on barrel-end are deep and fully legible. Price: $280 $260
 
7. 1910s Parker Lucky Curve 20 (smooth BHR, eyedropper filler, 14k XF/F Superflex/Wet Noodle nib). This full-sized model measures 5 5/16” capped. Parker collectors know all too well how much harder it is to find early Parker eyedroppers compared to say, Waterman 12s. This simple, utilitarian Lucky Curve eyedropper from the early teens is made of smooth, black hard rubber. Slip cap came clipless from the factory (no holes drilled for a clip). Long Lucky Curve feed is intact. This pen is an eyedropper. The section unscrews for the barrel to filled using an eyedroppepipette – holds far more ink than a lever filler of the same size. My usual caveats about early eyedroppers apply here. If carried, it is not uncommon to find a little ink on the nib or in the cap. Early 14k Lucky Curve #2 nib with teardrop breather hole yields Super-Flexible variation with softness and flow verging on that of a Wet Noodle (comparable to a soft dip pen nib). It lays down a smooth and consistent XF/F line that widens to a 4B+ (approx 2.4mm) under very light pressure (see WRITING SAMPLE). Thin hairlines with a light hand, strong snap-back, and reliable flow over its full range of flex make it another great choice for calligraphic writing styles such as Copperplate and Spencerian. Condition: excellent [B]. Black hard rubber retains its factory black color apart from minor fading to a deep, dark brown on the barrel visible under certain lights. Surface is smooth and lustrous with no deep scratches or other notable blemishes aside from a group of short scratches to the left of the imprint (see imprints photo). Nib shows a small scuff here and there and a scratch on one tine that has no effect on durability or performance. Manufacturer imprint on barrel and number stamp on barrel-end are deep and fully legible. A lovely writer and the first example of one of these I’ve ever offered. Price: $270 SOLD
 
8. c.1915 Parker 16 Overlay (gold-filled over BHR, button filler, 14k XF Wet Noodle nib). Measures 4 5/8" capped and 6” posted. While Waterman overlays of this period aren't particularly common, they're far more numerous than their Parker counterparts today. Parker overlays like this one were commissioned to the George W. Heath company in New York, who is credited for some of the finer overlays on early Watermans and Conklins as well. The gold-filled filigree over this black hard rubber ringtop features an exquisitely hand-engraved Art Nouveau pattern as well as an indicia on the barrel for engraving. The pattern is the earlier, more intricate design that's more sought after than the simpler Art Deco pattern of the later 1910s-20s. Barrel overlay is stamped "Parker Fountain Pen" along with patent dates from 1891 and 1905. Pen has an Xmas tree, Lucky Curve feed and knurled blindcap unscrews to reveal brass button for filling. To fill, one simply unscrews the blind cap, submerses the nib, and depresses the brass button once. The fine workmanship of this pen is complemented by an early 14k Lucky Curve #3 nib, a scarce “Lazy S” variant with long tines. The nib is a Wet Noodle with softness, variation, and flow comparable to that of a dip pen nib. It lays down a smooth and consistent XF line that widens to a 4B+ (approx 2.5mm) under minimal pressure (see WRITING SAMPLE). Another nib with astonishingly responsive snap-back giving it a precision feel and you maximum control over the line. Together with its thin hairlines and reliable flow over its full range of flex, this makes for an ideal choice for calligraphic writing styles. Condition: excellent+ [B+]. Overlay shows no brassing, dents, or other notable flaws aside from some pin-sized dings confined to the knurled portion around the top of the cap. Hard rubber retains its dark black color with scarcely any fading. Knurling of blind cap isn’t quite as sharp as it once was and number stamp on barrel-end is faint but legible under bright light. Manufacturer imprint on barrel is deep and fully legible. Price: $380 SOLD
 
 
 
Shipping: Pens purchased on the weekend are mailed on Tuesday. Otherwise they are mailed within 2 business days of payment. All pens that do not come with their original boxes are packaged in PVC or thick plastic tubes to protect them in transit. To CONUS locations the following shipping options are available:

• USPS First-Class with tracking for $5 Due to the delivery delays that continue under postmaster general DeJoy, I strongly recommend that the Priority shipping option be chosen. All packages will include full insurance (covered by me). Rest assured that a full refund is guaranteed (issued through Paypal) in the event of a lost parcel and you will not have to wait until I receive a reimbursement from the USPS.
  
• USPS Priority with tracking for $9
  

International Customers: Please contact me for shipping quote if located abroad (delivery confirmation required). (Note: due to the issues stated above, my international shipping options are currently limited. PM for more info). Please do not ask me to commit mail fraud by altering the declared value of a pen for customs. Not only am I registered as a business but shipping insurance is based on declared value.
New York Customers: For tax purposes, I am now required to add an 8% sales tax on any sale made in the state of NY. If your shipping address is in NY state, please let me know before payment to receive an adjusted total. Discounted shipping is included for NY State residents to help defray the extra cost.
Ordering: Pens are placed on hold for the first person to reply to the thread and PM me with firm request to purchase (no chat DMs please). A request with the words “I'd like to purchase [pen number]” would be best to avoid confusion), to which I’ll reply with payment details. Please note that a message inquiring into a price discount does not suffice to place a pen on hold. If I haven't received Paypal payment within 24 hrs after a hold is placed, then pen(s) may become available to the next person.
Payment, & Guarantee: Payment by Paypal only. All pens are guaranteed to be in the condition in which I've described them. If I've missed something objectionable or the filling mechanism is not fully functional, the buyer may contact me up to 7 days after receiving the pen for a full refund (issued once I receive the pen back in the same condition as sold). Buyer must ship the return no later than 2 weeks after it was delivered to receive a refund. I've sold pens online for over a decade. Please check my past listings here as well as on the classifieds and historical sales forums on FPN (username: Estragon) and FPGeeks (popcod) for some of my previous offerings.
 
 
OTHER OPEN LISTINGS

• Vintage Montegrappa Extra Edacoto
  
• Waterman Nurse’s Sets
  
• Off-Catalogue Sheaffer Stubby Balance Lifetime
  
• Psychedelic Bayard Excselsior
  
• Waterman Taperite Citation
  
• Conklin Enduras, Nozac
  

I thought maybe making a post about this would be helpful both for myself and for others.
I don't trust a lot of things in the world. No matter where you look, there are conflicting opinions about everything. Many people are convinced their opinions are absolutely correct, but somewhere out there, someone else believes their completely opposite opinion is correct. I don't feel that I have a ledge to stand on in this reality. It feels like free falling. Not sure why I'm starting with that, but it's a bit of stream of consciousness to begin this post with. Obviously there's a difference between facts and opinion, but even facts aren't as real as I'd hope they would be. Mathematics and science can only function if we make initial assumptions about certain axioms and preconditions. I go through the world not trusting anything at all to be real.
For most of my life, I've had debilitating OCD. I was officially diagnosed in 2021, but I've been dealing with it at least since my early teens. For the past year and a half, I've been fixated on the feeling that my own death is going to occur soon. A sense of impending doom. I can fight it, run from it, etc. But it has continued to come back. I think mostly because my brain likes to fixate on a problem until I can solve it. But obviously this problem can't be solved. I am alive, but there will always be a sense that it could happen today or tomorrow, even though it hasn't happened yet.
I've tried letting go completely, fixating on it even harder, etc. I've tried to force myself to believe it's not real at all.
I guess my reason for making this post is mostly to set another guide-stone for myself in the future, so I can look back and see I felt the same way and nothing bad happened. I've previously made several similar posts on other forums. I look back occasionally on them and it makes me feel better to know I'm still alive. Those posts were all from over a year ago.
I want those on here suffering through the same thing I am to know that I've been fixated on this for every day in a way that prevents me from even being able to focus well at work or home most of the time, for over a year. There has not been a single day or even hour, probably, in that time where I didn't think about it or feel some amount of pain from it. And I'm still alive. So those of you who have just started feeling this way, or have felt this way like I have for a long time, know that it's unlikely it will take you out since I'm still here. Try to breathe and try to enjoy every part of life you can, despite the internal torture.
Thanks for reading.

TL;DR: 11 year old recently announced they are non-binary. Do you have advice/tips for my kid and me (the parent)? Also looking for fun stuff that makes them feel proud and part of a community.
Hi,
My apologies if this isn't a proper forum for my post.
I'm a parent not very involved in the LGBTQ2s+ community but not completely clueless. My kid told me casually the other day that they are not a boy or a girl. They told their friends already but not the adults (school, friends' parents etc.) I am using neutral pronouns and I correct myself when I slip (I still make mistakes, it's been a week). The issue is that I have to switch back and forth because the other adults don't know and if I say "they" well, I am telling everyone, so with the other adults and strangers I use he/him. My kid said that's fine and asked that I continue that way. Is that something I should be concerned about? I offered to talk with the school teacher at least, but they declined so I figured I would just follow their lead.
I have no idea what kind of challenges and opportunities await a young kid who is aware and proud of their non-binary identity.
I looked up lots of websites and blogs online but a lot of resources relate to name changes and legal and physical transition. My kid, who hasn't hit puberty yet, isn't worried or sad about their body (other than wanting more upper-body strength). They don't want to change their name either. They do care about their looks and their true identity.
Do you have advice for the parents, like Dos and Don'ts? Also advice for my kid to navigate this time in their life?
They asked about the meaning of LGBTQ+ and during the discussion we looked at the LGBTQ2s+ flags and the non-binary flag and we discussed pride: their eyes started shining with excitement. They are only 11 years old and the social opportunities offered by advocacy groups in our area aren't available for them. They would have loved to join an LGBTQ2s+ group of tweens and young teens to play video games, shoot hoops, and skateboard. Do you have any advice on websites to check out, video games, youtube channels, streamers, books, comic-books, movies, TV-Show that may help them feel part of a community? ideally fun stuff at this point.
They are into Hilda, Nemona, Owl House, Gravity Falls, My Hero Academia, Amazing Digital Circus, Fortnite, Fall Guys, Minecraft and a bunch of obscure and often cute or silly stuff that I couldn't name :D
Thanks a lot.

Let me start with the summary version:
It all began when I first stumbled upon Inside Edition's videos of women - that's WOMEN getting slammed, insulted, and blasted for "showing too much of their body (with kids around)". Then it escalates further when they show a school is photoshopping out women's cleavages to make them look "modest" for their yearbook. I feel this type of treatment towards the female human is all wrong! Like, can't anybody learn to appreciate and look at the female body without censoring it in any way? Can't you let ANYBODY, including kids, get a chance to learn about the differences between the male and female human bodies????
Then comes along... you guessed it. That one video Inside Edition publishes. And after seeing her top blurred, my inner voice in my head: "That's the last straw!" Like, can't some of us get a chance to learn something new that just aroused our curiosity? Such as how the human body changes with time in terms of both genders? Like, now, I can finally visualize myself (my whole body) from little boy to fully grown man. But when Inside Edition published that footage, the new question that took me by storm is: what would a female look like from little girl to fully grown woman?
But with YouTube's broken comment system GHOSTING certain-to-random comments, even on my backup YouTube account, I can't seem to get ANY messages across!
Speaking of which, when I tried to post this on Feminism and AskFeminists, they BOTH perma-banned me for NO REASON and muted me from talking to their mods for 28 days!
Why do I say "no reason"?
"Hello, You have been permanently banned from participating in this subreddit because your post violates this community's rules. You won't be able to post or comment, but you can still view and subscribe to it.
If you have a question regarding your ban, you can contact the moderator team by replying to this message.
Reminder from the Reddit staff: If you use another account to circumvent this subreddit ban, that will be considered a violation of the Content Policy and can result in your account being suspended from the site as a whole."
As you can see, there is no specific reason listed in the message above. So this is why I claim or what I mean by "banned from a sub for 'no reason'. - Even for something that was never officially listed on that sub's rule board.
Once more, I, along with these parents of their own daughter proved one major point: if a male can go topless/show their body, then so can a female - regardless of age!
Can't I get a chance to learn something new? Some evolution/development processes for certain things can be a little more complicated then you originally first thought.
Now here's the detailed version:
Ok, before you start reading below, I want you to visit this and read the whole article to better understand my situation: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/kitchener-waterloo/guelph-parents-angry-after-topless-girl-8-told-to-cover-up-1.3124762
I got banned from Lemmy social site servers for "CSAM" all because of this: the Napalm Girl pic and another thing I saw on Inside Edition's channel in addition to some nude statues - literally artwork of naked people - all because I was trying to protest ~the inconsistencies of censorship towards the female human~ - regardless of their race AND age!
Let me be clear on one thing: I didn't post any "CSAM" on the Lemmy servers! I'm protesting something that I feel is unfair towards the female human.
Please ~actually watch these before jumping to conclusions~ so you can actually understand what I’m really protesting!
Women Who Were Told Their Outfits Were ‘Too Revealing’
Mom Says She Was Kicked Out of Gym For Revealing Tank Top: I Felt Humiliated
Cops Dragged Woman Off Beach After Complaint About Her Bikini
It’s one thing to say a girl’s outfit or body is “too revealing”,
Teens React After Yearbook Photos Are ‘Modesty Edited’
it’s two things to photoshop out a girl’s cleavage to make her look “modest” for a yearbook or a portrait!
9-Year-Old Saves Family From House Fire
But censoring a topless preteen girl who thought up an ingenious strategy to stay cool like her friends in the same stuffy room while at the same time not caring who’s around her? THAT’S REALLY CROSSING THE LINE!
It's all thanks to some videos from Inside Edition's YouTube Channel.All these videos Inside Edition posted are developing a question in my mind that's getting the better of me: why so much hate on the female human - even as children? Like, why do they censor the little girl's chest? Can't anybody learn to appreciate the appearance of the female body? Just like those parents of their own 8 year old daughter, I too am genuinely outraged by this type of treatment towards the female human!
And what's the big deal with nipples? I'm just trying to ensure everyone is treated equally regardless of race, and gender... AND age (after what I just witnessed). And if no one's gonna speak up about this, I might as well step up to the plate. After all, somebody's got to do it!
That little girl in the final video made two non-verbal messages clear: one: if a boy can do it, then so can a girl! And two: no one is too young for anything! As long as you have the knowledge capacity and I.Q level to do it properly and safely, you'll be fine. I was able to refuel my dad's car and cook my own dinner when I was 6 and without setting anything ablaze by accident.
However, when I try to illustrate with that video, even though Inside Edition is an official news channel, the responses I get back are rather bitter! They remove my post or ban me from the sites I post on for "promoting nudity involving a minor"!
~WHERE~
~CAN~
~I~
~ASK~
~OR~
~SHARE~
~THIS~
~SUBJECT?!~
Due to my autism, I only know basic English. So I need to illustrate to get most of my messages through. I thought hard, I tried, and low and behold, they were removed hours later mainly because they "didn't fit the subject of the forum". Even though my multi-subject based thread does have some material relating to this forum's topic. These sites and mods are all really stretching my problem solving skills beyond the breaking point for this one. I'm merely protesting with these pictures and videos as illustration. I'm not that good with words, so I need pictures to get half my messages across as noted above.
Many subreddits or forum sites don’t accept URLs, pictures, specific website URLs, or even a combination! Thereby hindering my ability to fully explain what I’m witnessing! In this case, the sentences “It’s one thing to say a girl’s outfit is ‘too revealing’, it’s two things to photoshop out a girl’s cleavage to make her look ‘modest’ for a yearbook.” actually corresponded to several videos I beared witness to on Inside Edition’s YouTube channel.
I actually tried to post that URL with that blurred 9yo girl in a subreddit in the past and you won’t believe this: I actually lost my reddit account for 2 days for “promoting nudity involving a minor”! Other sites like the adult video forums who accept uncensored nudity-based images I mentioned just delete my thread! Another site I recall banned me for 1 year for “spam” - even though I only made this protest post twice (after they removed it once).
So that meant I had to approach this from a different angle: after that experience, I got a little paranoid from using that said video URL to illustrate. So I tried explaining this protest without the URLs - and this is in conjunction with certain sites restricting my ability to post images, URLs, certain site URLs, or a combination. It seemed to end up making things worse! Because without the visual evidence, it makes it much harder to fully explain what I’m witnessing.
So without the URLs included - that visual illustration, on the sites I tried along with Lemmy World, it actually made things worse! That’s what lead Lemmy.World mods to ban me for life for “CSAM” or made other people think I watched child porn when I clearly didn’t. The lack of visual evidence (due to my past reddit experience combined with the site’s posting restrictions) is what lead to this “pedophile” confusion. So please help me talk some sense into the Lemmings world, Lemmy.ml, and Lemmy.world mods that this was all a major misunderstanding and Lemmy is pretty much the only reddit alternative out here where I can try asking another question. My attempt to appeal has failed on 3 Lemmy social sites - even after I tried notifying the mods on the third Lemmy server site before making the post, so I need your help now!
I felt after Inside Edition uploaded that blurred 9yo girl video… I thought to myself “That’s the last straw!” Someone needs to protest these absurd censorship laws that they apply to the female human!
Why can males show most of their body but females can’t? - In most cases that is? Whatever happened to "Free The Nipple"?
Children should have the same… rights to do things as any adult! It’s about possessing the knowledge capacity and I.Q level to safely execute this action. E.G, on those “Family Day” episodes of The Price is Right and Let’s Make a Deal; those kids made smart choices when picking the correct numbers to items to win a prize.
I’m not joking around here! This type of treatment towards the female human needs to stop - this includes race and age. - It’s like racist people, but in age form.
Does it look like I’m laughing for fun? Of course not! Since no one else is protesting this, and YouTube has a flawed comment moderating system hindering my ability to post on even random videos (I.E, "ghosting"), I have to take more drastic measures to protest by stepping up to the plate and shouting out “Can’t we all be equal in terms of a huge variety of traits?” Yeah, the last thing I need is a vein-bleeding broken-record robot impeding or hindering my ability to seek answers to a question!
We need to learn to appreciate or accept how the female body appears regardless of race and age!
Stop trying to blame it all on me! None of the stuff in the vids posted, is that. If it was, Inside Edition would be the guilty party, and Youtube for not having already deleted them. If it doesn’t violate Youtube’s TOS, it should be fine to post anywhere. If there was even a hint of impropriety to it, at the minimum the vid would have been age restricted.
No one would answer! Not even Inside Edition themselves were willing to offer an answer when I even found their email address, the sites dedicated to helping those in mental, suicidal, or emotional distress (those forum sites even PERMA-banned me for "spam" - that's right, SPAM! (Even though there was absolutely no mention of a permanent ban or rule about "spam" in their forum guidelines!) Is that the definition of "spam" when I make a bad thread only once?! And when I try to appeal the ban, the same message "please contact the administrator if it was done in error" is blocking my ability to click the contact button! Or sometimes it's a blank white page with that message in the top left corner of the window! - Which adds more insult to injury, because I can't click anything as all the buttons have disappeared! That means I can't log out of that site either!), OR the adult video forums that support uncensored nudity images would accept that video link URL let alone the entire topic itself! So I really am at a loss for thoughts and words on what I just experienced! Heck, I even tried the professional therapists of talkingforchange.ca But even they too were too reluctant to talk as they claim my post regarding the censorship of women is not for their platform and they disconnected the chat 2 seconds after their last reply to me. And I highly doubt that ANY site will allow me to illustrate with a picture of the Napalm Girl (Phan Thi Kim Phuc) when she was 9, certain pictures of Pampers diaper boxes (why do you think they (Pampers, Huggies, etc.) even allow a pic of a topless little boy or girl to be plastered on a diaper box we see in grocery stores/supermarkets everyday?), Leela when she was an infant in the episode Leela's Homeworld, or even Belgium's famous kids: Manneken Pis/Jeanneke Pis. That, combined with YouTube having a flawed comment moderating system hindering my ability to post comments on certain-to-random videos (I.E, "ghosting"), I'm forced to take more drastic measures to get my messages across. All this combined, ~I'VE NEVER FELT SO SHUNNED FROM THE INTERNET IN ALL MY LIFE!~
But here's a strange catch: sometimes on some sites, Napalm Girl is censored, other sites she isn't. So I felt that I need to protest this. It seems everyone is too chicken to even start this subject! Don't these numbskulls know not to judge a book by it's cover?! This is where I ask myself "NOW WHAT?!". This can't be one of those "exceptional" cases where they say "suicide never solves anything" doesn't apply to these types of situations. In other words, all hope for resolving these types of situations really is lost. I really do feel left in the dark on both the subject of sound effects and nudity!
Once more, I'm not being a ped, I'm protesting all these absurd censorship rules and regulations that revolve around the female human - regardless of race and age - after what Inside Edition posted. Watch the videos I found again for clarification. In other words, ~the inconsistencies of female human censorship~.
Can you really - you know, hurl insults at Inside Edition or blast them for what they did? It was their idea to publicly publish the footage. Just like how that one photographer made the choice to publicly publish footage of the Napalm Girl when she was 9 and completely nude. Therefore, it should be ok to share this footage anywhere.
But some areas censored Napalm Girl's nipples, but others did not - excluding her groin. Then there's the diaper boxes I found in any supermarket. And finally... Surprise surprise: typical women being scolded by other people for wearing something "inappropriate" or "showing too much of their body". I look around and since no one else is protesting about this, I might as well do it! After all, someone's gotta step up to the plate to hit that ball! I will not sit idling by the sidelines and continue to watch the female human get treated/censored like this! I will stand up, step up, and speak out towards these absurd reactions, rules, and regulations that revolve around the appearance and censorship of the female body! What about the famous Jeanneke Pis in Belgium? Do you think she along with other nude statues are trying to promote pedophilia?

Before I continue:

• no, I did not hail from the GVH fandom
• no, I'm not trans/nb
• no, I don't think SG is transphobic nor harbor undertones of such
• I am not against the LGBT community and very much support our queer brethrens to express themselves
• Trish > Naomi no diff (this isn't related I just wanna put it out there)

My reasoning is entirely subjective. Though I'll be referencing themes/plot points from the story I won't be reaching over my head to make my arguements. This is just how I feel. Your opinions regarding mine are as correct (and wrong) as mine.
With the idea that by E4, Fang finds her sense of self-worth and becomes truly herself, I find it a bit bland for the story to just turn Fang into a "normal" character; normal as in her aesthetics and behaviour are completely mellowed out when Anon comes back from college. It's a big shame, cause' I'm sure that Fang's aesthetic and identity was a big pull to why we like her in the first place (aside from wanting to bang qt goth ptero dinussy). It also feels a bit to me like character assassination. I'll explain more below.
Throughout the story and the subsequent events leading to E4 we see Fang discarding Trish's influences, but to completely rid of her history is unrealistic, I feel. Manipulation or not, living a whole year and maybe more in a certain mindset will change someone, moreso if they're a teen, and you don't just forget or discard it in a mere few months. You aren't just who you're born as, you're also influenced by your surroundings and your history. This is why you find stories of misplaced twins in orphanages who become completely different people when they meet again, because that's how strong upbringings can be.
Plus, regardless of Trish's manipulation, she still had a big hand in helping with Fang's life. They were still best friends with misguided intentions. Trish just wanted what's best for Fang, as twisted as it may be. I feel like the story overexaggerated how negative Trish's actions were. At worst, Fang simply had a phase like how all teenagers do. At best, Trish gave Fang an outlet to tell her worries and have friends she could count on during times of crisis. I'd argue Fang would probably be worse off if Trish wasn't there.
And, even if Fang was still a lost soul throughout the first half of the story, we could see her rough tenacity and strong headedness about an identity she supposedly didn't abide by. Being NB gave her an outlet to express her dissatisfaction against the world, and I think many queer people could relate to that before they eventually found their identity. It should make sense that her non-binary-ness(?) would dictate a major part of her metamorphosis into E4 Fang.
Now I'm not a writer (I've got 2 years as a failed fan fiction/original web-author and no finished series under my belt) but I would make it so that Fang still retains her non-binary identity but frame it so that she's non-binary BECAUSE it dictated much of what she's experienced during her growth, not because Trish told her she's NB. I'll even go as far as to make her gender fluid (NB/Female) and adopt she/they pronouns, as a way to combine canon Fang together with my interpretation of her.
This also serves to aid Anon's character arc. He'd supposedly learned to have empathy and compassion for things he doesn't understand or agrees with by then, so better way to show that growth other than for him to start using Fang's preferred pronouns? He could start small, by interjecting with a small insult every time he has to consciously use [they] to refer to Fang, but he comes to get used to it overtime and finally learns to accept it by the end.
I understand this isn't a popular opinion and that it cuts Fang's detransition which plays a big part in her finding an identity but I like what I've substituted: acceptance of not only self but your past and the people that came along the way.
•
No doubt there'll be unsavoury, bigoted comments below but I hope the responses are civil. I know we hail from the Mongolian basket weaving forum but come on, it gets old, y'know. I just want to discuss headcanons and analysis for a second instead of shit flinging in /pol/.

Taking off for Rome this Sunday and this forum has been extremely helpful! I have done a search and I am unable to find some shopping tips places for young adult females. My Dght (19F) is looking forward to shopping...not looking for the Gucci or Versace's (tho I am sure she would LOVE that) but smart teen fashion stores. You all have come thru many times before....any suggestions? Thank you in Advance for your help

For the longest time in my life, I've struggled with thinking differently from the majority, getting my opinions validated. Growing up as a teen in the 2000s, I found solace playing video games, Maplestory, FlyFF, Granado Espada were my main games. It provided the freedom for me to think, something that school didn't. My teachers would advocate memorizing, it was the best way that everyone did to score well during exams, only to then forget everything afterwards. At primary school level, I did exceptionally well in Maths, but I was horrendous in languages. I was then invited to the "gifted programme" test, only 3 students were invited in my level as I recalled, something that Singapore does to identify gifted students, which I overslept for. What a absolute blunder that was, haunted me for years.
So back to video games, it was my guilty pleasure, I loved MMOs because they had the skill points system which required careful investment in useful skills within certain limitations. I'd spend hours thinking about the best builds.
Back then, gaming forums were the sites I used to frequent. While there were plenty to explore, I would spend hours reading guides written for each class. The most popular guides for each specific class were always pushed to the top of the list. However, I'd find myself looking at sub-optimized builds that didn't make a whole lot of sense to me but comments would be raving for what they call, a perfect guide. There was a clear disconnect between the way I think and how others did. While I felt uncomfortable doing things different, going against majority's opinions, I felt compelled to.
It was logic. I've always had this highly logical mind that I had assumed to be present with people because it was simple to me. "Don't touch the boiling kettle". You don't have to ask why. It's hot, it can burn you, that's bad, don't touch anything that could be hot for that matter. It's common sense, even a 7 year old would understand that much. As I grew up, common sense stopped appearing common with people.
I often found myself having the "hot" take on various topics, debating with others online. It was hard to ignore their arguments because it was illogical, it didn't make sense, it was flawed logic. They would cite their qualifications as proof of intelligence but lacked any logic and critical thinking in their reasonings. I hate sounding so condescending at times but it felt like I was fruitlessly trying to argue using logic with people who had none. I was often outnumbered in my way of thinking, fighting a losing battle every time. It led to moments of self-doubt when 9/10 people insist you are wrong, despite all the reasonings you've provided and you are mass downvoted.
You begin to question yourself at times. Are you really as intelligent as you think you are? People certainly don't seem to think so. I believe that I'm intelligent but I could never really prove it because I've never gotten myself officially tested. I'd admit that I dragged it out for years because I was afraid to find out, to find out that I was perhaps in the top 20% and nothing more than that. Or that I'd miss the mark and fail to join Mensa because I'd only have 2 lifetime tries at Mensa Singapore. I had tested myself on various online IQ tests, Norway Mensa was the most prominent of the bunch, I'd receive scores in the 99th percentile, dating all the way back in 2019 (old version) and 2021 (new version) but I was never sure because most people said these online IQ test were neither accurate or comparable to the official Mensa test.
What is intelligence? One time, I was posed this question and thought hard on it and this is what I arrived at.
Intelligence is the degree of one's logic. When one possess superior logic, they have superior intelligence. Having superior logic grants better critical thinking skills, reasoning ability, fluid reasoning which allows one to evaluate better, weigh the pros and cons, compare the options and make the optimal choices. Logic is the building block of intelligence. Logic is intelligence itself.
Anyways, I took the official Mensa Singapore test [MSAT] last month April, and received the acceptance letter recently in the 99th percentile! It had given me the clarity that I needed. I feel validated and have a newfound understanding of my experience. I'm excited to meet like-minded people and be part of Mensa!

I searched this forum for Yardbird reviews prior to posting and found it odd there were none in there. I then crossed against Google Reviews to see if I was way off but it seems to be in-line there.
My wife wanted to go to Brunch but not on actual Mother's Day - been there, done that, our kids are teens now. So went to Yardbird, the day before - mostly because we hadn't been there and the vibe seemed great.
TL;DR: I would skip this place
Yardbird, from the jump throws you off. There are what appear to be two entrances with two signs but you can only get in from one - the side opposite the Rivian dealership. Its impossible to tell how to even get in, at a glance. Once you enter, there is a large bar with a reflective mirror and a lobby area. This is done, presumably to make it look larger inside but the place is already huge. And it took me a solid minute to realize that I had to walk right into another area for dining (I had been parking the car).
The vibe itself is actually nice. Its clean, its wide, its antique coutoure if I had to give it a definition?
Once we sat down, we realized the booth seats are set no more than maybe 18" off the ground. They are so low that my kids were chin below the table. And the booths are so wide taht you can't even use teh back to prop yourself up against it. It just feels like they were trying to be different for different's sake instead of just making the usecustomer comfortable. This is a trend.
Once we got to the table, it took approximately 17 minutes before we were offered to take our drink order. We checked this because we arrived right at our reservation time so I just matched it against my watch. The only saving grace the whole day was our server. I wish I remembered his name but he was fantastic. Attentive, asked questions, explained things but ultimately the food and drink matters more.
They had reasonably priced unlimited mimosas and I ordered a bloody mary but I had to specify to put vodka. They default to bourbon - I understand if that's your thing but its not the default. Its different to be different. The drinks for the table - were sub-par. The bloody mary was lifeless, had no spice, and the only thing I tasted was Tajin.
Once our orders were taken, we waited approximately 40 minutes before getting our food. Which generally is fine for our family as we had nowhere to be but the place was not busy. There were multiple open tables, most of whom were 20 somethings and early 30's - small tables. Easier turnarounds. I would venture the place was half-full.
For a place that specializes in fried chicken, the chicken was dry, tasteless, and felt like it sat under a warmer once it was made earlier in the day. The biscuits - which is supposed to be their thing - were dry, again very little flavor, and just unintersting. Instead of creating a biscuit that was warm, fluffy, and flavorful, they had this contrarian biscuit style just for the sake of it, it felt like.
I won't get into detail on each plate as it was more of the same. I personally ordered the chicken and waffles and they didn't even serve it with their "famous" bourbon maple syrup. If that is your famous accoutrement, I would presume it would be at the table prior to the food coming out or included in a ramekin.
The entire experience was so below average for what I presume is a massive rent bill and inventory cost to build out. I think its a chain? I am not certain but I was certainly bummed out. As Denver's breakfast scene has fallen out of favor with lots of people, I was hopeful maybe this place would be different but more of the same.
At the price point, I would stay far away.
​
​

As a former “spends all her time on a fan forum” teen I would drop approximately $200 for a Dropout branded Qwoky Pet or knock off strawberry squishmallow keychain.

I have always lived on the west coast of the US (CA, WA, and now OR) and have been coin roll hunting (on and off) since I got into coin collecting as a kid back in 1995. We have family in Michigan and Pennsylvania, and as kids when we took trips back there we would often get rolls from the bank to go through. We mostly did pennies and nickels back then, and tended to find more older wheat pennies (figure pre-1940) and more buffalo nickels in PA and MI vs CA. In CA we had much higher changes of finding coins with mint marks compared to PA and MI (S mint coins in particular). All of this has seemed to line up with a lot of what I have seen posted in online forums and on this sub-reddit, and makes sense since the populations of the western states was generally very low till the depression and and dust bowl when people started moving west, and even more so WWII when there were suddenly mass amount of manufacturing jobs on the west coast. I have found this track very closely with what I have found coin roll hunting on the west coast.
I currently live in the greater Portland, OR metro area, which is where I get most of the coins I roll hunt. I recently took a week long trip to visit family in the greater Detroit area (and photograph the solar eclipse), and took the opportunity to try coin roll hunting in MI again. Below are some statistics for find for the first three months of this year in Portland (area) and what I found in the week I was in Detroit (area). I only included pennies and nickels as that is all I searched any real quantity of while in MI. For ease of travel I was mostly dumping at coinstar machines for no fee amazon gift cards, and had a finite amount of amazon gift credit I had need for in the near future. I did not include date ranges for the pennies as I have not been good at keeping track of that info. What I can offer is that I found 3x teens pennies in MI (all Philadelphia), and 3x teens pennies in Portland (2x Philly, 1x SF). With all that said, the sample sizes here are far too small. They give an interesting picture, but to really compare a much larger sample size for both would be very beneficial.
Pennies:

Portland Area:
$236 Pennies Searched

46x Wheat Pennies 1x per $5.13 

Detroit Area:
$85 Pennies Searched

25x Wheat Pennies 1x per $3.40 

Nickels:

Portland Area:
$1192 Nickels Searched

197x pre-1960 Nickels 1x per $6.05 6x War Nickels 1x per $198.67 3x Buffalo Nickels 1x per $397.33 0x Liberty Nickels N/A 1x Proof Jefferson Nickel 1x per $1192.00 

Detroit Area:
$300 Nickels Searched

60x pre-1960 Nickels 1x per $5.00 2x War Nickels 1x per $150.00 1x Buffalo Nickel 1x per $300.00 1x Liberty Nickel 1x per $300.00 0x Proof Jefferson Nickel N/A 

Some observations/differences:

• I ended up getting more customer wrapped rolls in Detroit than in Portland.
  
• In both locations some amount of the customer wrapped rolls appeared to have been already gone through/were someones dumps (nothing interesting found, all/almost all coins facing the same direction.
  
• For pennies in particular both numbers were "poisoned" a bit by bank/fed rolls of new coins (box or two of brand new pennies in Portland, $20 worth of 1959-D and 1963 Fed bank rolls in Detroit.
  
• Nickels had a lot less difference than pennies. A larger sample size would really help in seeing if these numbers remain close of diverge.
  

Well, there you go, hope someone finds this interesting...