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This is concerning the CSA surrounding Diana Paxson and her family. Huge trigger warning for that in the rest of this post.
Recently we've had some discussion on the sub concerning Diana Paxson, her family and child sexual abuse, and to a lesser extent the content of her works as an author. The TLDR about her books is that her books are not good sources to read - this post is not about that, so if you want some details about that you can check out this post.
This post is a copy/paste of text from a PDF statement from someone within The Troth. There are links and a few screenshots so I highly suggest you go read the PDF directly. The Troth seem to be trying to sweep this under the rug as they usually do in times of controversy, and I know many members here have been concerned about Paxson lately and choose to no longer support her, and more members who are currently unaware. Don't let this get swept under the rug. Let it be known what Diana Paxson is implicit with, and that The Troth seem to be trying to bury it. From here on out is the PDF text:
CW: discussion of child sexual abuse, victim blaming, and other upsetting topics
Concerns about Diana Paxson and Troth handling of concerns
I have been an active Troth member since approx 2017. I first met Diana Paxson in person in 2019, and she became my Troth clergy program mentor in June 2023. We began to have regular Zoom meetings with the two of us. In February 2024, I watched Netflix’s Last Chance U season 5, episode 4 "Greyhaven," where Diana Paxson is interviewed, and was disturbed to learn more about the history of child sexual abuse among some of her close friends/family over the years. In this episode, regarding convicted child molester Walter Breen and alleged child molesteabuser Marion Zimmer Bradley, Diana is quoted as saying, “If we only had perfect people writing, there would be nobody to write. What we should be doing is honoring what people manage to achieve despite their flaws.” She also says several other things in this episode that did not sit right with me, including her reported “theoretical” awareness of Breen's desire to molest children.
Upon researching more on my own, I learned about Breendoggle (https://breendoggle.fandom.com/wiki/Breendoggle_Wiki) and the reportedly widespread awareness within sci-fi communities of the time of Breen’s previous criminal conviction and ongoing, active child sexual abuse, including reportedly widely witnessed allegations of sexual abuse of children as young as 3. (Decades later, Breen died in prison after multiple felony convictions related to child sexual abuse.) I learned about recorded court testimony alleging Diana Paxson was asked by a victim’s mother if it was safe for a child to visit Walter Breen and that she allegedly said yes (http://marionzimmerbradley.com/index.html). I learned of allegations that ADF founder Isaac Bonewits was allegedly living with Diana Paxson when some of his alleged child abuses took place, though Diana denies this. I also learned that even though one of Bonewits’ (and Breen's and MZB's) victims, Moira, was reportedly quoted on Diana Paxson’s website in 2014 (https://wildhunt.org/2018/01/accusations-of-abuse-surface-against-adf-founder-isaac-bonewits.html) to reassure the public that Diana reportedly did not know about the alleged abuses, and that this alleged quote remains on Diana's website at the time of this writing (https://diana-paxson.com/writing/avalon/marion-zimmer-bradley/), I learned that contrary to this, in 2015, Moira actually implied/alleged that Diana was an abuse enableapologist, alleged that she (Moira) and others made more recent police reports regarding child sexual abuse allegations about Diana's husband Don Studebaker AKA Jon DeCles (https://askthebigot.com/2015/07/23/the-story-of-moira-greyland-guest-post/), and alleged that his family had “closed ranks” to protect him. In 2022, Moira repeated this allegation more directly and in more detail, including alleging that Diana was “covering for” him (see attached screenshots). I also found multiple other online allegations of past and current alleged abuse-enabling or apologism linked to Diana, reportedly across decades, from a variety of people claiming familiarity with Berkeley pagan communities.
Disturbed, I decided to talk to Diana one-on-one over Zoom and ask her about the topic directly. On Tuesday, February 13, 2024, over a private Zoom call, I expressed respectful concern, expressed that I was disturbed by her words and some of what I had been reading, and engaged Diana in a conversation on some of these issues to get her perspective. Diana alleged that she does not commit crimes. That said, over our approximately two hour conversation, she repeatedly expressed several beliefs that I found and continue to find disturbing, especially coming from someone who is a well-known figure in the Heathen community, a clergy member, and a leader. During our conversation I made several efforts to give her the benefit of the doubt, respectfully debunk opinions I found harmful, keep an open mind, and offer her opportunities to clarify. Despite this, her words in the conversation left me with even greater concern than before, not less. During and immediately after the call, I took notes on her statements to me to aid in my recollection, and after processing my horror and disappointment, on February 26, 2024, I filed a formal complaint to the Troth, detailing my online research and my direct experiences. My impressions of our conversation were what I perceived to be overall themes of ongoing belittling, disbelief of, and disdain for multiple child sexual abuse victims/survivors including legally-proven victims, recurrent victim blaming statements, lack of understandingvabout the harms of grooming, lack of understanding about children's inability to consent, conflation of sexual violence against children with orientation/queer identity, recurrent use of language like “boylove” and other harmless-sounding terms to refer to what is actually violence, repeated dismissal of the need to proactively protect children in questionable situations with known pedophiles, and several more alarming themes, all in response to me expressing real concern about real people who have experienced real harm committed by Breen and allegedly committed by several other people connected to Diana.
Though tone is subjective, I was also personally shocked at what I perceived as a casual, bemused, and at-times cruel demeanor when discussing actual proven victims, and what I perceived as a lack of expressed remorse, concern, anxiety, regret, sadness, or any other empathy-driven emotion regarding people suffering significant harm from sexual abuse.
My current understanding as of May 7, 2024 is that the Troth has concluded their investigation and has quietly asked Diana to train replacement(s) then step down as coordinator of the clergy program and editor-in-chief of the Idunna magazine, but that Diana will still be allowed to retain clergy credentials as an ordained Troth clergyperson, her status as official Elder in the organization, and membership in the organization overall. I feel this is a disservice to all members of the Troth, and particularly to families with children and any members who have experienced sexual violence. I myself cannot knowingly remain in an organization that continues to knowingly honor and welcome an Elder, clergyperson, and member with these expressed viewpoints and these ongoing allegations, and I feel it is my duty as a community member to inform others of my concerns.
Troth Bylaws state several relevant policies:
• “The ethical conduct of all persons who represent The Troth is of vital importance to this organization, because it is through our members and officers that our reputation as an organization is formed, as is our organizational Wyrd.”
• “sexual misconduct is prohibited by this Organization and will never be condoned or tolerated.”
• “Officers and clergy within The Troth may be subject to more scrutiny and greater accountability than the general membership.”
I am in no way accusing Diana of any crimes, because I do not personally have legal evidence of that. I also do not know what her inner experience is like. However, someone can be deemed an inappropriate organizational leader and be unwelcome as a community member due to their expressed beliefs, words, and harm to community trust, even without being convicted of any crimes. Troth members deserve to know what their respected elder is saying–and in the case of Last Chance U, what she’s saying in public. I’m saddened if this statement means the end of my years as a Troth community member–and it will be if the Troth does not take additional action–but some things are more important. Much love and gratitude to the many good, decent people I’ve met over the years in this space. Please spread the word if you can. Remember: All children deserve to learn, grow, and be nurtured free from exploitation. Child sexual abuse is never okay. Victims/survivors, no matter how imperfect, are never to blame for being abused. Break the cycle and speak out, like Havamal 127. May the truth prevail, whatever that may be, and may those who have been harmed find healing and relief.
With love, and as an act of love,
Bat
EDIT: As there has been some confusion, I am not Bat. I am a link in the chain. A chain that has since been silenced. The comments are shut down with a passing
However, so long as I have this post up, I think this needs to be said. Why are community leaders in this sub accepting and even defending this behavior from the Troth? They are the face of inclusive heathenry. Is this the face we want to show the rest of the world? Holding those who protect child molesters in esteem? All the Heathen community wants is some basic accountability and leadership from the Troth. The Troth's action reflect on all of us, and it past time that their actions reflected that reality.

Damn that line hits like a truck.

So are they not banning Boylover de Fleur now or what?

I (FtM 19) have been repeatedly treated poorly by both online and local lgbt communities (including irl communities is 2 different states now). It’s made me feel completely outcasted and discouraged in my own transition. to the point that I’ve been prescribed T, but can’t even look at the bottle without falling into immense depression let alone use it and make the progress I’ve always wanted. For a little bit of background info I’m a really small guy. 5’4 on a good day and incredibly skinny due to unrelated health issues. That combined with my age makes meeting fellow lgbt people a complete nightmare. I’m tired of the invasive comments and jokes about my assumed twinkish bottomhood. Or worse the claims that I deserve harassment because of the way I look. It’s to the point where I no longer feel safe at any public pride events because I can’t protect myself in any way from the gross sexual advances or comments. No matter how many times I state my boundaries they get brushed aside All because i PHYSICALLY fall into a trans stereotype.
my personal goal has always been a very traditional timeline of hormones and surgeries and clothes that make me look like “just some guy”. I like sports and camping and cars. I leave the house in blue collar attire and bind and pack. Even got so far as to have minor facial hair when I was taking T consistently. But in spite of it all no matter what I do I’m treated horribly by other trans people. It’s making me feel like all my effort has been pointless. While cis people will either respectfully refer to me as male or not clock me as trans to begin with, trans people will openly mock my stereotypically cis interests and attire. I even had someone at a pride event tell me I was dressing FOR cis people and that it made me look “like a trump supporter”.
I’m proud of who I am as a TRANS man . My attire and goals come from both my lifestyle and influence from the butch lesbian community , NOT the approval of cishets . I just don’t know what I’m going to do if there’s no place in the community for me. Do I need to go completely stealth to protect myself from other lgbt people? God knows publicly talking about having a BOYfriend has only increased the harassment. It feels like other trans men my age see my relationship like boylove Yaoi anime. Which both hurts as an overstep of boundaries but also completely discredits the relationship I’ve put so much care and time into. I’m not a walking porno or some satirical joke. I’ve been entirely disowned by all my family and some friends for the choices I’ve made to get on HRT. so where do I find people who will genuinely respect me ? Right now the idea of the lgbt community being “my people” feels like a lie.
I dont care if this post receives advice , encouragement , or even just opens a conversation of how cruel we can be to each other. I just needed to say this somewhere. I hope I feel safe enough to start T again soon

I (FtM 19) have been repeatedly treated poorly by both online and local lgbt communities (including irl communities is 2 different states now). It’s made me feel completely outcasted and discouraged in my own transition. to the point that I’ve been prescribed T, but can’t even look at the bottle without falling into immense depression let alone use it and make the progress I’ve always wanted. For a little bit of background info I’m a really small guy. 5’4 on a good day and incredibly skinny due to unrelated health issues. That combined with my age makes meeting fellow lgbt people a complete nightmare. I’m tired of the invasive comments and jokes about my assumed twinkish bottomhood. Or worse the claims that I deserve harassment because of the way I look. It’s to the point where I no longer feel safe at any public pride events because I can’t protect myself in any way from the gross sexual advances or comments. No matter how many times I state my boundaries they get brushed aside All because i PHYSICALLY fall into a trans stereotype.
my personal goal has always been a very traditional timeline of hormones and surgeries and clothes that make me look like “just some guy”. I like sports and camping and cars. I leave the house in blue collar attire and bind and pack. Even got so far as to have minor facial hair when I was taking T consistently. But in spite of it all no matter what I do I’m treated horribly by other trans people. It’s making me feel like all my effort has been pointless. While cis people will either respectfully refer to me as male or not clock me as trans to begin with, trans people will openly mock my stereotypically cis interests and attire. I even had someone at a pride event tell me I was dressing FOR cis people and that it made me look “like a trump supporter”.
I’m proud of who I am as a TRANS man . My attire and goals come from both my lifestyle and influence from the butch lesbian community , NOT the approval of cishets . I just don’t know what I’m going to do if there’s no place in the community for me. Do I need to go completely stealth to protect myself from other lgbt people? God knows publicly talking about having a BOYfriend has only increased the harassment. It feels like other trans men my age see my relationship like boylove Yaoi anime. Which both hurts as an overstep of boundaries but also completely discredits the relationship I’ve put so much care and time into. I’m not a walking porno or some satirical joke. I’ve been entirely disowned by all my family and some friends for the choices I’ve made to get on HRT. so where do I find people who will genuinely respect me ? Right now the idea of the lgbt community being “my people” feels like a lie.
I dont care if this post receives advice , encouragement , or even just opens a conversation of how cruel we can be to each other. I just needed to say this somewhere. I hope I feel safe enough to start T again soon

Hiii, so i want something smoking hot, and i mean it. Something that has drama, kissing, s3x and happy ending this us the most important. I have already saw rwrb, loved it, btw it can be bl i like boylove. Anyone but you was great. Young royals fantastic but not enough hotness. So please help me write down your favourite movie thanks 🥰

Hiii, so i want something smoking hot, and i mean it. Something that has drama, kissing, s-3-x and happy ending this us the most important. I have already saw rwrb, loved it, btw it can be bl i like boylove. Anyone-but-you was great. Young-royals fantastic but not enough hotness. If you can help me comment because i would love to watch some good quality movies or series. So please help me write down your favourite movie thanks 🥰

Hi, everyone. As promised here is an updated compilation post of some of the wonderful resources and posts this sub has to provide. I posted this eight months ago and again five months ago adding things as time went on
If this is your first time seeing this post it is a general post that includes some of our users favorite BL resources outside of reddit, deep dive posts on various series, in depth posts on various aspects of BL, spreadsheets/doc/tracking materials for BL, and anything else that is interesting that has popped up in the sub. This is by no means complete and I would love for people to chime in with posts or resources they would like added to this.
Every three months or so I'll repost this so that our new people or those that didn't see it the first time around can get a chance to see it. If you have the post from three months ago saved go ahead and update to this one since it will be the one, I will now keep updated. Also, if your post, resource, site is on here and you don't want it to be let me know and I will remove it.

If you have posts you would like to add PLEASE comment or DM me to add them. I don't always catch interesting posts so everyone's contributions help 🙏

Introduction/Info/In Depth discussions of BL Genre and subjects related to it

• A BL Fans Guide to Visiting Thailand by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• A guide to Thai BL production companies by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• A BL viewer's guide to Thai school uniforms by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• Early History of Thai BL by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• Updated family tree of Thai BL & deep dive into the Thai BL landscape by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• production queues (the "Q" number) by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• Thailand’s Cute Boy Craze by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• The House of Thai BL by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• An index of posts all done by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• Missing in translation - the drama of Thai pronouns (Star In My Mind Ep1) by u/dangrankeyi
• A Japanese BL appreciation post. By u/smittenkittyyan
• Difference between Thulakorn and Raikantopeni ? by u/Noo_thing
• Thai Boys Love (BL)/Y(aoi) in Literary and Media Industries: Political and Transnational Practices (Intersections: Issue 49) by u/Virtual_Tadpole9821
• BL Cinematography - Part 2 by u/madego3293
• Underrating, under promoted,underfunded and misunderstood. byu/Ihateyourbees
• Podcast: Confronting BL Misconceptions by u/nana-shi-74
• How does a censored BL get produced in China? by u/SpontaneousStupidity

Series Specific Guides and In Depth Discussions

• Bad Buddy and the Thai Y Market by u/dangrankeyi
• A Retrospection and Analysis of the Eclipse; Episode 1 by u/OtterlyLost
• Mame Universe Map By u/coIacider
• *cries in international fan* 😭(Maps of Mame universe) by u/Choice_Ostrich_6617
• Plot Structure Analysis for Love in the Air (So Far) by u/WritingAndPuppies
• KinnPorsche and the Topic of Trust by u/Application_Lucky
• My Thoughts on how Kinn and Porsche Really Feel About Each Other by u/Application_Lucky
• An Analysis on Kinn and Porsche's Relationship in the show vs the book (major spoilers ahead) by u/Application_Lucky
• Color and Lighting Symbolism in Semantic Error by u/dangomaiden
• My review about Utsukushii Kare/My beautiful man ( MBM). Share your opinion as well if possible. By u/smittenkittyyan
• Today is My beautiful man's 3rd anniversary and I wanted to remind everyone why this bl has the best attention to details compared to all bl I've seen by u/Bakufanforlife
• My Personal Weatherman Language Analysis by u/NeedOffDays
• My Personal Weatherman Timeline by u/NeedOffDays
• Source vs. Adaptation - The Sign : boyslove (reddit.com) by u/samptra_writer
• Source vs. Adaptation - Manner of Death by u/samptra_writer

​
Spreadsheet, Documents, Lists on BL entertainment

• The Spice Index for BLs with NC scenes - Happy Ending? - Where to watch? - Asking for help from all BL fans!!!!!!! By u/Persephone
• Fan Made MasterDoc for Trigger Warnings. Please contribute! By u/iblanchard
• All Upcoming BL (M/M Media in General) for the current year by u/queen_of_the_moths
• BL Buying Guide by u/Longjumping-Ad-6775
• A list of 836 BL Series and Movies from 2022 to 1990's with legal links to stream them by u/Longjumping-Ad-6775
• Created a BL Watch Tracking Spreadsheet by u/theakirasama
• A List of BLs You Can Watch on YouTube* (U.S.) by u/ZeroHourSun
• Asian Drama Notion Template by u/hollycenations
• The BL music available on Itunes/Apple Music US (ringtones too!) by u/lalachans

​
Notable Posts Not to be Missed

• The Best of boylove in 2022
• Thanks to our On-Air Thread Masters and My Lessons Learned by u/lrt23
• What are some interesting things about this sub? by u/ILoveMoschino
• BLs Under The Radar by u/madego3293
• Let's Try To Find Official Platforms For These Movies/Series by u/MidwesternLibrarian
• (Top Post in the sub) [Semantic Error] Park Jaechan hopes Semantic Error can serve as a gateway for eliminating prejudice against same-sex relationships by u/MarSlem
• Quick intro and chat by u/jaiamour
• The Economist Publication: Boys' Love Article about Foreign Investment in Thai BL and Predicament for Thai Government by u/ThoughtsAllDay

Resources outside of boyslove

• World of BL series information and watching links
• BLTai BL news site
• BLUPDATE Twitter BL News
• BL_Scenery twitter BL News
• https://www.fujoshi.info/ BL history, terms, in depth look at BL
• Absolute BL on Tumblr Review, news, general talk
• BL Watcher Review site
• Amino Discussion group
• ThaiBL - BL song list 2.0 More Song, More List! by u/lalachans
• BLJapan - Japanese BL music, playlists to explore the music of our favorite shows by u/Longjumping-Ad-6775

MDL Lists on BL

• MDL User Bambikill lists for BL
• MDL User Lys Lists for BL(u/queen_of_the_moths)
• MDL User DramaLover143 Lists for BL

Previous resource posts: 1 2
*Last updated 5-12-24

Hi ! I wanna ask if anyone knows where to read we best love book 2 ? I can’t find it anywhere